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The METZ 1944 Cuff Title

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  • Antonio Scapini
    replied
    Originally posted by Jochen1000 View Post
    Also interesting, however, is the question if members of that school were virtually the only soldiers who ever wore that cufftitle. [...]
    If I were a collector of cufftitles, I would keep in mind the possibility that the school was virtually the only place where those cufftitles were
    ever used.
    The "Metz 1944" was a combat award and also a traditional decoration. This is written in the original decree.
    Furthermore there are pictures showing soldiers wearing that CT also out of the school exactly as they wore Afrika and Kreta cufftitles. Of couse many wore it as a traditional cufftitle.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kyle Harrington
    replied
    Additional photo Metz Soldbuch

    Metz
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • Jochen1000
    replied
    Hi, I have a copy. Should I look up something?
    BR


    Originally posted by Lothringer1944 View Post
    Hello,

    A document of the Fahnenjunkerschule VI from Metz.
    To the american from WAF, do you have an access to this document : ?

    https://www.loc.gov/manuscripts/?all...t:metz&st=list

    Thanks in advance

    Regards

    Leave a comment:


  • Lothringer1944
    replied
    Hello,

    A document of the Fahnenjunkerschule VI from Metz.
    To the american from WAF, do you have an access to this document : ?

    https://www.loc.gov/manuscripts/?all...t:metz&st=list

    Thanks in advance

    Regards

    Leave a comment:


  • Kyle Harrington
    replied
    Fascinating stuff gents

    Edward sterling stuff and thank you for clarifying the confusion, really important for further research into this area which is still worthy of more study.It is difficult to envisage the NCO/Officer cadets not fighting in the precarious position which faced the defenders, or I may well be wrong? Nonetheless all comments have been greatly appreciated on this thread may many more contributions ensue.

    Thanks Kyle

    Leave a comment:


  • schoenwurf
    replied
    Salut,
    To me it definitely looks like a reproduction
    Even if it would have been made for a vet (which I doubt) it’s not original...

    Leave a comment:


  • Lothringer1944
    replied
    The METZ 1944 Cuff Title

    Hello all,

    What do you think about this one (friends owner). It doesn't look like an original, but it doesn't look like a bad reproduction...

    Maybe a cufftitle for vet ?


    94568606_861694790995928_4365024474660077568_n.jpg

    94488507_226761435404441_8521452506696384512_n.jpg

    94487684_2704587676439871_4458459727247966208_n.jpg

    94702523_2962011093890861_5456067547914829824_n.jpg

    94341818_237033450866573_289897330268700672_n.jpg

    Thanks in advance

    Regards

    Leave a comment:


  • Jochen1000
    replied
    Paper

    This is a very interesting topic. I saw the soldbuch and the little piece of paper in post 92. What Edward and glaser say is correct,
    members of the school were entitled to wear the cufftitle, even though they were usually not involved in the fighting around Metz.

    Also interesting, however, is the question if members of that school were virtually the only soldiers who ever wore that cufftitle. I have so
    far seen two soldbücher to candidates who were with school VI during the fighting, neither had a cufftitle entry. I have two soldbücher for normal
    soldiers with combat days near Metz (Machern), neither has a cufftitle entered. I have several soldbücher to members of replacement units who were
    *probably* there during the fighting, none had an entry. Possibly some were captured before they could have been awarded the cufftitle, but others
    were not and there would have been enough time for the entry. Still it did not happen. Has anyone actually ever seen an unquestionable award
    entry for a member of the actual fighting force in Metz? I can't remember, and I am looking for one for a long time.

    Fake award entries for the cufftitle are relatively common. Example: post 20 (stamps and signatures are correct, award entries are faked). I attach
    a picture of another fake of that typ - probably even made by the same guy.

    If I were a collector of cufftitles, I would keep in mind the possibility that the school was virtually the only place where those cufftitles were
    ever used. And in that case, I would expect someone would have ordered a batch from one supplier, and the delivery would have consisted of CT which
    all look the same. But I don't know how ordering processes for these things were then.
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • glaser
    replied
    I think I understand the logic now: for some reason, those who attended this school (as a teacher of a student?) were permitted to wear this cufftitle as a member of the school and thus not because they earned it personally, that is why they have to remove the CT when they leave the school again.

    Leave a comment:


  • Edward
    replied
    Originally posted by pauke View Post
    Seems a little odd to me that there is no date listed as to when the "right to wear" note was issued or is this on part of the paper we can't see here?
    Have only seen two school examples in passbooks. Neither were dated.

    Leave a comment:


  • Edward
    replied
    Slip of paper looks legitimate. Auction description is incorrect. From the auction, “signed in pencil by the commander of staff of the 462 ID.” The document was signed by the Major u. Inspk. Chef Schule VI für Fahnenjunker der Infanterie. The stamp was partially cut off at the bottom. From other entries in the Soldbuch it is connected to the schools 10. Inspektion. Which was also the command held by the Major who signed the doc. Likely the last school class before the war ended.

    Worn also by both staff and students while assigned to the school. Once reassigned the armelband was to be removed from the uniform.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kyle Harrington
    replied
    Metz 1944

    Glaser,

    The answer to your question is I do not know.The CT was awarded to thoses who fought as one would assume.I have posted images of the Soldbuch where his confirmation of being an officer candidate is included.Here is an image of an award ceremony, as to when ????? All curious stuff !
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • glaser
    replied
    Originally posted by Kyle Harrington View Post
    Please excuse the paper entry I thought it might be interesting for those interested in the Metz Cuff Title
    Very interesting paper, for what reason did he had to remove the cufftitle after his course? That's not common practice?

    Leave a comment:


  • pauke
    replied
    Seems a little odd to me that there is no date listed as to when the "right to wear" note was issued or is this on part of the paper we can't see here?

    Leave a comment:


  • TP Alexander
    replied
    Originally posted by Kyle Harrington View Post
    Please excuse the paper entry I thought it might be interesting for those interested in the Metz Cuff Title
    Always happy to have fresh information or regulations regarding wear of the cuff title or photos of it worn by recipient!!

    Leave a comment:

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