Ss jul corner tapestries - modern production

[Capt. R]

1. I bought my original tapestry from an estate in Germany. They did not know what it was so it was not expensive.
2. It did not come from Steve T.
3. It did not come from Thorsten. I have another one that originated from Thorsten and it is a repro.
3. Thorsten would never sell a fake one to Steve T because:
a. Steve T knows better;
b. Thorsten needs Steve T to explain ss kulture to him; and
c. therefore, he cannot alienate Steve.
4. Steve T has studied these tapestries and is the only expert that I know on these pieces. Instead of bragging, Steve does his research and cautiously and carefully examines all the evidence.

I am done with all this now.

[Gaspare]

interesting topic...

Saw some of the photos in the catalogs posted.. Looks like they use period equipment to make these? or at least something close to period equipment.?.
Natural materials,,and non synthetic dyes are still made... Bet you could probably 'custom' order a piece too..

[Thorsten B.]

"I am done with all this now."

Good for you.

[Michael Fay]

Originally Posted by Gaspare

interesting topic...

Saw some of the photos in the catalogs posted.. Looks like they use period equipment to make these? or at least something close to period equipment.?.
Natural materials,,and non synthetic dyes are still made... Bet you could probably 'custom' order a piece too..

Gaspare,
you have some good insights
and I get your main point,
one could custom order up a design that would seem a perfect SS style motif with no images in the catalog so no one can say it is a modern rug offered in the catalog! = probably has been done-and will be done.

The bottom is falling out of the SS and Heimatwerk rug market.

If natural materials and non synthetic dyes are used then no use testing them either.

[Thorsten B.]

"The bottom is falling out of the SS and Heimatwerk rug market."

According to that "logic" the whole Militaria market would be long gone.

As we all know by watching the market that is not the case - actually judged by recent price results the TR/SS cultural market is going stronger than ever before.

Most of the cultural pieces are still highly underestimated so if you come across one that suits your taste - don´t miss it.

[Minnesinger]

I like to think that mine is good too, but hey, what do I know.

As far as childish remarks on ever visiting Externsteine by some goes I guess I'm an even bigger expert on these things playing in front of Klusfelsen as a child and climbing around on it.

Anyway - I have some pretty new photos of "rug-production" but I cant recall if I posted them in the thread that Michael correctly calls a black hole. If anyone remembers them or not please say so. I'll post them here.

[Robert H]

And a good thousand German mark picture is hanging on the wall next to her machine.
All this is a German traditional desing, used prior of the IIIReich after and still in those days.

Originally Posted by Michael Fay

Gaspare,
you have some good insights
and I get your main point,
one could custom order up a design that would seem a perfect SS style motif with no images in the catalog so no one can say it is a modern rug offered in the catalog! = probably has been done-and will be done.

The bottom is falling out of the SS and Heimatwerk rug market.

If natural materials and non synthetic dyes are used then no use testing them either.

[Minnesinger]

Here is a album of some newer photos of these being made. http://imageshack.us/g/4/5702930760648fc644c7b.jpg/

[Thorsten B.]

That´s awesome - even the old machines are still in evidence and working.

So when restoring DHW furniture pieces one can find the perfect upholstery fabric - new but in the classical style and so good for daily use - perfect!

Thank you for sharing the pics with us.

[Thälmannpionier]

wonder why this is so hyped now...these facts that those rugs are still made today, except the new cataloge pictures, were already dicussed and discovered in the cultural Thread...last year.
Also the photo from the maschine and the Links were posted here long ago...so why acting so surprised now??

[Minnesinger]

Originally Posted by Thälmannpionier

wonder why this is so hyped now...these facts that those rugs are still made today, except the new cataloge pictures, were already dicussed and discovered in the cultural Thread...last year.
Also the photo from the maschine and the Links were posted here long ago...so why acting so surprised now??

I think it's good to have these in a thread of their own. They just drown in the other one and when you post something about them the next 40 or so posts has pictures of candlesticks (and don't get me started on the candlesticks as they are a dime a dozen, so if you get one make sure you get the provenance to go with it). If you didn't know better you would guess that some just wants to steer discussion away from the subject at hand.

[Thälmannpionier]

Originally Posted by Minnesinger

I think it's good to have these in a thread of their own. They just drown in the other one and when you post something about them the next 40 or so posts has pictures of candlesticks (and don't get me started on the candlesticks .

totally agree on your points

[Michael Fay]

Originally Posted by Robert H

And a good thousand German mark picture is hanging on the wall next to her machine.
All this is a German traditional desing, used prior of the IIIReich after and still in those days.

To tighten up the time frame of the photo:
I'd say:
the operators hair cut is circa 1960s-1970s
and what era did women start wearing clothes like that? i d say early 1970s

[juoneen]

It seems to me, if someone isn't satisfied with an item purchased,as to originality,... such as the tapestry here in question, a refund is in order, and the tapestry should be taken back by the seller .

Especially if the seller is sure it IS original, and the buyer isn't comfortable with it .Do do so, shows credibility, and honesty, and makes for a sign of good faith.

That also means, IF the tapestry is original, the sellers item is worth more now than when he sold it, and to take it back should be no problem, and there would be no need for disparaging or flim flamming excuses, and inuendo dodging the issue to refund in full.

To give a full refund would be proof enough he is being straight to make sure the buyer is happy, and all respected sellers always do this , when a buyer isn't happy with something regardless of time after the sale, if the seller is truly honest to the core.

To refuse to do so, especially under such scrutiny in a forum as well read and impressionable as this forum is....to not do so, and make any other excuse or excuses to why the seller cannot do so, would mean a red flag on the sellers reputation , and strong evidence its obviously fake, and common sense dictates, if this doesn't happen the seller should slink away with tail between legs and forget having any credibility in all future dealing here, as he sunk his own battleship , or hung himself with his own rope as we say where i'm from.

Thats the bottom line , and if it isn't an original, and can be purchased to order to any specs or design by those with the old weaving mills hired for piece work, wich i believe is possible even today, the refusal to "make it right" regardless of sellers opinion of originality when the buyer is not convinced ,is strong enough evidence to show the profit IS the greater motivation for one deal ,and it's obvious the seller can't afford to pay the guy back , and really needs the money so bad he will say anything ,using his silver tongue ,to keep it . This hedging, will likely destroy his reputation for future business here ruined by one deal, and the losses for not making this customer happy by giving a refund , id venture to say...in the future the sellers losses will greatly outweigh any small profit made from a flimm flam on this one tapestry. Maybe even hurt him, by cutting him out in the future on getting information on ss items that would also help him turn the knowledge into cash in some future deal worth more than the lost profit on this item in question mr fay isn't happy with.

By allowing one unsatisfied customer in front of the world watching this discussion, would be foolish , and to continue to do so would not be prudent and be evidence of a credibility gap in judgement regarding honesty in good faith when doing business.

This uber discussion....reminds me of the chris ailsby fandango ,and its hurt not only his book sales, but his reputation for not nipping it in the bud sooner to geter done..... so before it gets to where it is a liability to the seller, i'd say make the buyer happy, post a statement of intent to pay him back in full...and, just refund the money , buyer sends back the tapestry at his expense...and everyone can move on to the next cartoon. Or seller walks about with a cloud over him from now on, and his parade will be rained on from hence fourth. Its his choice...what more needs said at this juncture??

[Capt. R]

Originally Posted by Thorsten B.

Stop with your replacement activities and just post the catalogue.

By the way:

Your avator pic shows a place I visited first when I was six years old when you had no clue what and where that is and still you have not made it over here to make any experiences by yourself - so don´t talk dirty to me.

How is this relevant to the tapestries? You don't know where I have or have not been. Just because I don't beg you for a tour of Wewelsburg like other forum members who come to Germany doesn't mean I have not been there.

Will you have as much nerve to try to buy something from Dennis Porrell again after libeling him all over this forum?