How to prevent runner marks and clean an SA dagger

[Mac 66]

Originally Posted by kingtiger

Scott,

No I have not seen them that bad. Some staining and etching is all I am aware of. I think to put pits in nickle silver, some other corrosive substance was responsible but that is just a guess on my part.

Mark

Ok Mark no worries, So do you recommend cleaning up verdigris covered crossguards with semichrome or autosol to remove the hard baked on green gunk?

Regards Scott.

[kingtiger]

I think the green vertigris (as opposed to very hard dirt) is best just flicked off with a wooden toothpick. You would not want to scratch the fittings with anything harder. Wood is always better than metal to get funk off delicate metal parts..toothpicks really do a great job...even in cleaning up grip eagles...then Q-tips for the cleaning stuff up close.

Never Dull is good after the dirt stuff is gone then just wipe that off..gently and then put Renwax on and gently but thoroughly wipe it off too.

You should be very pleased with the results and have a lot of pride too knowing YOU did it.

Best of luck..."slow is your friend"!!

Mark

[Ed Sunday]

Originally Posted by kingtiger

Thanks for that info Ed, I only saw one in 45 so I thought it was a repair. I have about 150 to go so I will see if I find any more. Although I am not much of an RZM fan...they eat themselves alive without my assistance and I know of no way to stop the "lifting" of the plating. Do you?

Mark

Mark theirs no ways to stop that lifting short of having them replated. To this date I 've not seen any that were replated properly. They all look more like a nickel chrome rather than that old soft yellow tinted nickel that is more of the period. I believe it was called ;Watts Process. I talked to one place that knew what I was after but said I'd have problems dealing with the waste removal and the EPA.

[carlos1]

I hope the moderators,can make this tread pinned.It is a fantastic tread

[JR.]

One area that you will see vertigris etch nickel is in the top fitting of say an SS or SA scabbard if a vertical hanger has been snugged against it over time. I've also seen it on the upper lip of the scabbard of a Police degen where the blade buffer pad laden with vertigris will etch the part that it is lying against. As expected, the thinner the surface of the metal, the more susceptible it is.

[Mac 66]

Mark a few more problem points which i know are problems with SAs/NSKKs ect is a very tight top nut & a loose scabbard weight, is there any helpful ways to tackle these problems?

Thanks Scott.

[kingtiger]

I have seen the top (pommel) nut tight and I suggest a small drop of break free or penetrating oil be applied to where it touches the top fitting and let it sit for a day or so. It makes a BIG difference in getting it off. Then when you get it off, put a VERY light coat of that oil on the threads and the inside of the nut. You won't have that problem again if you do that. It is MOST important to use the correct tool to get that pommel nut off. More SA and SS daggers have been damaged by pliers or a vise grip than anything else. Patience is the key. Penn fishing reels sells a flat wrench that will go under that nut or big dealers also have them, Whittmann, Johnson and a few more for example. Resist the temptation to use a towel around the nut and then a vise grip to prevent marks...the risk is too great and it will usually leave marks and make you very disappointed. That may work...BUT rarely.

A loose scabbard weight is often due to a short screw being used in the lower fitting. A longer one will touch and bite slightly into the lead weight and hold it in place. These screws are also at bigger dealers. Personally, I would NOT introduce anything that was not supposed to be inside the scabbard to glue it in any other way. At the factory they were tapped in with a special tool, press fitted, if you will..very carefully but firmly. Then the lower screws held them firm.

I hope that helps you.

Mark

[schönbeck]

I think the dremel kit has a very flat wrench that fits perfectly. THe ones you usually find is to thick but you can easily grind down the wrench and it will be perfect. I have done it for several persons tools and so far all have been able to use it.
YOu got to choose a wrench with the correct size else the pommel will be rounded.

The screws that the big dealers sell is often not original dagger screws, its simply something they have bought, and so can eveyone else also do. A well equiped hardware store should have or be able to order the screws. And for the price the dealers charge you can buy entire box.
And NO there is no difference!

[Larry Lipps]

While I'm of the opinion that the best way to prevent runner marks is to store the dagger out of the scabbard, and this thread will encourage some bumble fingered collector to strip out his scabbard screws, it still has some really good information. We'll pin it for awhile and see how it goes.

[daggeron]

I must say when i first started reading your thread i pulled a face at stripping a scabbard apart, then i remember'd i have an SA which is tight when taken in or out of the scabbard, so i read your post over and over to make sure of no mistakes and as you well said "took my time", correct driver a must! and made sure i didn't slip with it, a short time later and a lot of gunk removed it is as smooth as it should be, so i would just like to thank you for your thread in saving the blade of one of my SA daggers, many thank's for your time and knowlage,
thank's again Ron

[kingtiger]

Ron, I am very pleased to know it worked for you. It is a simple process and patience is key. No one starts out to ruin a dagger and I am pretty certain that a lot of the dealers do this routinely. I thought it was time to just show pictures of what things looked like and what to expect inside the scabbard. In my own opinion, this type of information helps collectors understand how these daggers were made and why simply keeping the blades Renwaxed or coated in silicone or other substances caused problems. Essentially, everything you put on a blade sooner or later transfers to the runners or the bottom of the scabbard.

I used to keep all my blades out of the scabbards too and still do on others like 1st Luft's for example, but my problem was that I had collected a whole lot, over 200 of the SA/SS design and simply could not make the room to keep them all displayed or stored properly.

To each his own...this worked and I had the correct tools and attitude approaching this task...55 more to go!

Mark

[Ed Sunday]

You mean you're not done yet !! Shoot I'd of had all the guns done by now !

[preachere]

I just cleaned up my SA and Red Cross hewer and what a difference it made! The SA had moderate crud on the runners and the hewer had slight crud as the runners were made of steel. The funny thing is the SA feels better, of course, but the hewer is now very smooth and it had the lightest of crud in there. I did observe that one runner was slightly bent up by the throat and so I gently twisted it back into shape, so this is probably the reason for the improvement.

Both scabbards got some Q-tips and swabs run down inside of them and then blown out with air. Then everything got the Renwax treatment.

Let me also say that this was my first experience with Renwax even though I've heard of it for years. It was this thread that finally pushed me over the edge and motivated me to buy some. I am impressed with it.

Regards,
Eric

[Ed Sunday]

Good for you , glad all went well without a hitch

[Jawohl]

Hiya--newbie here. I'm a new owner of an early SA dagger, and I want to clean the runners, as per Kingtiger's advice. But I can't shift the throat! Would it be siezed in? The throat screws came out easily (no marks), but the thing itself seems solid. There's mention in this thread about a block of hardwood: thing is, where to hold the scabbard?
Seems an exercise in contortion to get any thrust on the throat lip, while keeping the throat body of the scabbard held, firmly but gently...
Should I try to pull off the throat complete, both parts, and separate them after?
Any tips? Thanks!
Henry