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Old 03-18-2018, 04:10 PM   #91
Bulldog
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I was wondering if the dagger that showed up at the SOS was stolen earlier than the others and that's how its still in the United States, maybe it was stolen at Wittmanns local post office or by the person who picked it up from there, guess we will all have to wait and see what pans out. That said there's been plenty of time for it to have been here, there and everywhere by now.

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Old 03-22-2018, 06:50 PM   #92
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An intersting occurrence, but as a postal worker myself of over 30 years, i can tell you that this part,
Because of the loss amount, the insurance company actually sent representatives to Amsterdam and Finland, questioning the appropriate postal people as well as the Finish cousin at his factory.
is funny. Who do you think they could visit at a post office in Amsterdam?

Packages from US-Finnland go first to a post office in Amsterdam ? no, to a sorting depot near the airport for further transit, a big warehouse almost fully automatic, not a post office, there will be nobody to talk to about a package like this in transit.

You believe that there is a single person in the depot there who would be at all responsible for the millions of packages they handle each day?

And send a person to question the cousin at the factory in Finnland? Do you believe that a insurance firm in America, has "power" to visit with anyone in other countries and waste their time?
When large money is involved, police are turned on, (insurance to police) and that is how real life works, agency and police, that way if anybody is to be talked to, you have a chance. Insurance agency can talk to Americans for sure, but here in Europe you are a tourist, no more!

If any day comes where some representatives from America come to me to talk about a package, i will say f*** off i go for my break now, get off the property! That is a fact! Without police, you have no chance to question! And to get police involved on a international matter, for a box of nazi daggers worth $100 000? What reality does the author of this story live in?
Watching to much soap box TV drama!

I dont know what happens here, but for sure no American insurance comes to question people in Amsterdam and Finnland!
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Old 03-22-2018, 07:29 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MFarbe68 View Post
An intersting occurrence, but as a postal worker myself of over 30 years, i can tell you that this part,
Because of the loss amount, the insurance company actually sent representatives to Amsterdam and Finland, questioning the appropriate postal people as well as the Finish cousin at his factory.
is funny. Who do you think they could visit at a post office in Amsterdam?

Packages from US-Finnland go first to a post office in Amsterdam ? no, to a sorting depot near the airport for further transit, a big warehouse almost fully automatic, not a post office, there will be nobody to talk to about a package like this in transit.

You believe that there is a single person in the depot there who would be at all responsible for the millions of packages they handle each day?

And send a person to question the cousin at the factory in Finnland? Do you believe that a insurance firm in America, has "power" to visit with anyone in other countries and waste their time?
When large money is involved, police are turned on, (insurance to police) and that is how real life works, agency and police, that way if anybody is to be talked to, you have a chance. Insurance agency can talk to Americans for sure, but here in Europe you are a tourist, no more!

If any day comes where some representatives from America come to me to talk about a package, i will say f*** off i go for my break now, get off the property! That is a fact! Without police, you have no chance to question! And to get police involved on a international matter, for a box of nazi daggers worth $100 000? What reality does the author of this story live in?
Watching to much soap box TV drama!

I dont know what happens here, but for sure no American insurance comes to question people in Amsterdam and Finnland!
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Old 03-22-2018, 10:31 PM   #94
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Last edited by W.Unland; 03-22-2018 at 11:25 PM.
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Old 03-23-2018, 07:33 AM   #95
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The story what I was told is this;
Dagger was sold to other collector. Not sent to the customer.
Collector that bought it had to keep it al private, and NEVER sell it on the market.
But then, the collector died and the dagger came on the market.

That would explain how the dagger turns up in the States.
Makes sense.
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Old 03-23-2018, 08:05 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob NL View Post
The story what I was told is this;
Dagger was sold to other collector. Not sent to the customer.
Collector that bought it had to keep it al private, and NEVER sell it on the market.
But then, the collector died and the dagger came on the market.

That would explain how the dagger turns up in the States.
Makes sense.
makes a lot of sense. Before I knew this dagger was claimed stolen, I assumed it showed up at the SOS at that price and without paperwork or provenance because someone died and the seller didn't put the attribution to the dagger.
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Old 03-23-2018, 03:06 PM   #97
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I have been following this discussion with great interest and would like to say a few words on the matter.

First off, Its troubling to me that Tom Wittman brought this issue up in such an unprofessional way with innuendo and accusations. Seriously, when was the last time any of you "lost your cool" and screamed so loud at a party that the whole event came to a screeching halt? This is high school type behavior and has no place in this hobby, it is shameful and Mr. Wittman needs to apologize to JR and his son. In his own words Mr. Wittman admitted to covering up and hiding his "mistake" so as not to look bad to the collecting community. Because of Mr. Wittman's lack of candor and honesty a good and respectable man and his son got caught up in a situation that never should have happened to begin with.

Some of the most respected individuals on this forum have brought up the many discrepancys in Mr. Wittman's version of events surrounding this dagger and in my opinion make good points regarding suspected insurance fraud. Insurance companies take this sort of thing very seriously and much of what Mr. Wittman has admitted publicly is very concerning.

I would also like to say that I have worked with both JR and his son Kris for some time now and have the upmost respect for both of them as do countless collectors on this and other forums. Both of these men have been unwavering in their honesty and commitment to our shared hobby.

If the forum will indulged me a bit longer, I would like to share my personal experience with Tom Wittman's "integrity". For those that are interested the entire ordeal is documented here:

http://forum.germandaggers.com/~germ...tml#Post321385

To summarize my experience with Mr. Wittman, As a novice in the field of German daggers I was given Tom's name and told he could be trusted to help guide me through the minefield of fakes and scam artists. I called and explained to him that I was just a beginner and asked him for his help. Instead of helping Mr. Wittman took advantage of my self proclaimed ignorance by selling me the most God awful SS parts dagger in existence. After much arguing he ended up refunding MOST of my money. I just chalked it up to paying for my education and moved on.

The best part of that whole ordeal is that I was subsequently given JR's contact info. I called JR and Kris, told them of my troubles and that I was just starting out and needed some guidance and help. Unlike Mr. Wittman, JR took the opportunity to help educate me and in doing so has earned a customer for life.

Please don't misunderstand me, I am grateful to Mr. Wittman for advancing the hobby with his wonderful books. He has however lost my confidence and I will never buy another dagger from him nor could I in good conscious recommend him to another collector.
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Old 03-23-2018, 03:26 PM   #98
rob NL
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Wow Marvin, that is one of the most ugliest dagger I have seen in a while, no offense to you! You did the right thing sending that "thing" back.
Funny to see that some guys in the GDC went silent when they found out it was Wittmann who tricked you. LOL

What really puzzles me is why would you keep silent when a 100K!! package goes missing
Why would one do that?
Instead of letting everybody know that the dagger is "stolen" so that it will loose most of it's value, if not all of it??????
Very very strange.

Last edited by rob NL; 03-23-2018 at 03:33 PM.
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Old 04-05-2018, 01:56 PM   #99
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Well this has been an interesting read.
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Old 04-09-2018, 07:42 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by james m View Post
From Wittmann's account

"I had lost some of the best and most historic edged weapons to surface in years."

It's not the first time that's happened to him. He lost his entire show inventory once when his car was stolen from a motel parking lot before an OVMS show circa 1990.
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