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Old 01-14-2009, 05:19 AM   #61
Walter Sp
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Hi Robin

the guy on your posted pic is SS-Hauptsturmführer Oskar Wolkerstorfer. You can search with the name and you'll find an old thread with all his docs incl. all docs for his at least 4 TDB's

greetings

Walle
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Old 01-14-2009, 05:14 PM   #62
Bill Murray
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Hi Guys:

This subject is way out of my area of research but I found it fascinating.

Couple of questions.

The most such badges worn by one person in this thread is 5.
I would have to assume that a tanker or anti tanker that started the war and survived even a few years destroyed more or was involved in the destruction of more than five tanks.

In that context, was the badge awarded to the tank commander or gun commander only or to all the crew of either weapon that destroyed a tank.

Were LW pilots, especially Stuka pilots, given credit for and a badge such as this for the destruction of a tank that could be proven to have been destroyed by their actions.

To my first observation, were multiple awards perhaps handled with a star or a clasp or some such as was the case with US decorations.
In other words after five such awards, which seems to be the length of that fellows sleeve, were subsequent awards indicated by some fixture on the original patches.

Further to my first observation, do any of you great researchers know what individual holds the record for most verified tank kills and a subsequent question is was it split out by tank vs tank, anti tank vs tank and aircraft vs tank and I suppose individual actions (sticky mines/molotov cocktails etc.).

Thanks for any input/observations.

Bill
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Old 01-14-2009, 05:30 PM   #63
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the tank destruction badge is for destroying a tank with hand help weapons like magnetic mines panzerfaust etc! i think the record is 28! at the 5th kill you got a gold strip as the single one is white!
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Old 01-14-2009, 05:47 PM   #64
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For those who are interested (and i think you might be)

this is video of the Die Deutsche Wochenschau and at 7:20 seconds it shows a TDB winner (a lieutenant) with 11 kills but only 1 badge(in white).. look and see how they award him for the other 10.....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ubtr6P4yG2Q
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:09 PM   #65
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Hi scarey,

the lieutenant was Lt. Heinrich Zubrod. He was awarded on 18.01.1945 the knight cross and was kia 9 days later (27.01.1945).

greetings Walle
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Old 01-14-2009, 08:15 PM   #66
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Walle,

Thank you. I was wondering his name. I was having trouble making it out. Would you happen to know of any photos of him circulating around?


Again Thank you
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Old 01-16-2009, 03:19 PM   #67
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Bill,
This award was for destroying a tank in 'close quarter' combat. This means with hand held devices such as Teller mines, Molotov Cocktails, Magnetic charges, Panzerfaust, Panzerschreck etc. Tank and anti-tank gun crews were not eligible unless they used hand held weapons.
The highest number of awards was 21 to Oberleutnant Günther Viezenz who was rewarded with a Ritterkreuz on 07/01/1944.

Cheers,

Neil
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Old 01-16-2009, 07:47 PM   #68
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Thanks Neil and the others of you.

Not to get boring here with questions from outside my field, but may I ask if similar personal decorations were awarded to commanders/members of tanks/antitank artillery/aircraft units that had verified tank kills.?

I am aware that tankers could paint kills on their cannon barrels as could antitank gunners and I think I remember Stukas with tank kills painted below the cockpit.

Please do not spend a lot of time on the answer, a simple yes or no will suffice.

Bill
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Old 01-16-2009, 08:07 PM   #69
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nope! it was only for hand held up close and personal tank kills!!!!!!!
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Old 01-18-2009, 05:13 PM   #70
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What a wonderful thread. That's a nice film with Zubrod. And many nice photographs of tank destruction badge holders too. Viezenz never recieved 21 badges, nor did Anding recieve 18. These claims have to do with authors and others making "wishful interpretations" of photos. I can't see why these claims does not cease to circulate.

/Daniel
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Old 01-18-2009, 06:17 PM   #71
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I have already posted that this subject is out of my area of research, and I fully realize that this Forum is not supposed to get involved in politics, but one thing really struck me when I watched the Wochenshau video from 18/01/45 and then when I selected and watched what I presume was the "Last Wochenshau" which was made at the end of April 1945.

My knowledge of German is limited to a few well known words or phrases as well as a lot of technical terms, so I may have missed something, but...........

The 18/01/45 show was a marvel of propaganda in my eyes and showed a Germany that almost could not have existed at the time.

Happy, well clothed and well fed people riding the RB, the same sort of people apparently donating clothing to the Military etc. etc.

Given that I do not understand the language, they may well have been saying times are tough but one does not get that impression from the visual aspect of the film.

The "Last" show shows a very much more desperate set of circumstances but again shows shots of rows of tanks and other vehicles in action shooting off all kinds of ammunition that I wonder still existed in April 1945.

Mind you, at the not so tender age of 68, I remember sitting in the local cinema and seeing the same type of propaganda films regarding the US efforts in WWII. I am well aware that all countries do this sort of thing to keep up morale on the home front.

I just felt saddened watching what I assume the average German citizen was watching in their cinemas and thinking to myself, I hope they really knew that their world is about to come crashing down on them and the Government is still saying, "Fight on-Fight on".

In retrospect, I suppose the same thing happens today but I just thought to add these thoughts.

Bill
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Old 01-19-2009, 05:46 PM   #72
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Bill,
nice sentiments. Hard to think that the 'star' of the movie was KIA just weeks after the film.

Daniel,
I'm interested in your comments about Anding and Viezenz. 'The book' states 18 and 21 respectively and this is what's listed on your panzerknacker thread on the ahf.
Please put my mind at rest.

Cheers,

Neil
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Tdb
Old 01-20-2009, 09:58 AM   #73
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DEAR NEIL
REGARDING ANDING I HAD SEE (ON BOOK TITLED TANK KILLER) THAT WE HAD SIX TDB IN SILVER AND ON HIS AFTER- WAR TUNIC (ON WEST GERMANY FORCE) HE HAD 1 IN GOLD AND 1 IN SILVER; ON ANOTHER PHOTO (EASY TO FIND ON THE WEB) HIS FIRST 3 TDB APPAERED IN GOLD AND LAST 3 IN SILVER.
I THINK THAT THE FORMER CASE IS RIGHT.
REGARDING VIEZENZ WE HAD ONLY ONE OF HIS PHOTO WERE HE SHOW 7 TDB AND ANY MORE (note that he had preferr not to describe his actions).
mea
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Old 04-02-2009, 01:07 PM   #74
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To rebirth this thread.

Major Kurt Creuznacher, DKiG on February 14th, 1.942 while serving at Kradschützen Batallion 2, 2nd Pz.Div.

Photo taken in Smolensk.

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Old 04-02-2009, 01:09 PM   #75
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Panzer Grenadier NCO


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