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Bundesrepublik Deutschland, 1949-Present From West Germany through to the modern reunified German Republic.

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Old 10-16-2015, 12:37 PM   #781
michelwijnand
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I meant a green piped Bergmütze in coarse Trikot, with fake flaps.
I'll have to wait for it to arrive to take a photo, I'm having major problems with not being able to see many ebay photos right now, so I can't save/post them.

I figured the part about the 2 straps and canteen/tin order, as I see those worn both ways, but the "wrong" way around like you say was more prevalent, so I was going to stick with that, good to hear that's the way they were supposed to wear it. Was there any reason why they switched the sides?

I'll have to find some straps, I see only the ones with grooves along the edge, and I was told those are all police, even though some BGS straps (for example several on my backpack) do have grooves, right now my tentroll is held together with BW straps I had lying around, as a place holder.
The roll gets pretty fat when rolled to 28cm, looks pretty strange like that compared to my WW2 ones haha

Cheers,
Michel
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Old 10-16-2015, 12:51 PM   #782
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ok, Bergmütze with fake flaps could be early 60s or 70s. They switched between patterns in 1960s-70s several times, as I mentioned.

The BGS straps have groove around edge too, never heard specifically as police issue, unless marked so. It is feature of most postwar leather straps. I have BGS marked straps with grooves. The 28cm roll is from veteran, I find it difficult to do, mine is more like 30cm I think.

This is my setup for Zeltbahn. Mid-50s, but wear is the same (except gasmask can).



Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-16-2015, 09:40 PM   #783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus1989 View Post
This is my setup for Zeltbahn. Mid-50s, but wear is the same (except gasmask can).
I have BGS marked straps from the late 1950s or early 1960s (I forget which) that do not have groves along the sides. I am sure over time BGS used a variety of straps. I'm sure they were not too fussy about their design

Are your grooved ones marked BGS? Are they dated?

Steve
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Old 10-16-2015, 09:44 PM   #784
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michelwijnand View Post
As of now, I only need to get some shoulderboards, boots, and enough straps to put the tent on the belt. Were these rolled to the same width as in WW2?
I'll check and see what I have to spare. Do you know yet if your jacket has the narrower (earlier) or wider (later) type loops on the shoulders? If you have any sort of BGS or Polizei rank you can figure it out easily.

Steve
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Old 10-16-2015, 11:27 PM   #785
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collectinsteve View Post
I have BGS marked straps from the late 1950s or early 1960s (I forget which) that do not have groves along the sides. I am sure over time BGS used a variety of straps. I'm sure they were not too fussy about their design

Are your grooved ones marked BGS? Are they dated?

Steve
Not all straps used by BGS are marked BGS (same as y-straps). I have several 1958 dated and 1954 dated, only maker marked. Also BGS-marked straps dated 1962 and 63. All have grooves. The 1954 dated one is very poor condition and grooves are hard to see, but still present, so that could be the case too.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-17-2015, 04:02 AM   #786
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That's a very nice 50's kit you have there! I've seen that old type gasmask can on some photos from I think early 60's too, together with some guys wearing the GM54 one.

Well I don't have any packstraps yet, but the grooved leather straps I meant on the large backpack are part of the shoulderstrap system, so have no markings.
The only similar thing I have is a grooved leather messtin strap marked BUND PSL, nothing else.

I don't have any BGS/Polizei ranks yet, and I have yet to learn about the narrow/wide loop difference.
The small loops are 1cm wide, and have a hole under it of 2cm.
Some other features are still earlier type, like there being no traces of a BGS bow patch ever being attached to the flap, and the post-type buttons Collectinsteve once mentioned, those were an earlier detail too I think?

Oh yeah and the cap was dated 1964.

Cheers,
Michel
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Old 10-17-2015, 09:33 AM   #787
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I was lucky to find several of the gasmask cans, but took me several years to put that set together! They were used into mid 60s, until replaced with the larger textured can. By early 70s, they had the M65 tho (always a few years behind the Bw), but rarely wore the bag in field.

I am confused, you mean the shoulderstraps attached to the rucksack?

The second model Sumpftarn jackets were introduced 1967/68 and shoulder arch was introduced first 1970, so it is possible, that your jacket never had it I guess.

The narrow vs wide refer to the strap part under the board. The wide ones have plastic stiffener in them.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-17-2015, 03:04 PM   #788
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Well there's the part of the backpack's shoulderstraps that go to the belthooks at the front, and the narrow ones going under the armpit to the bottom of the backpack, those are grooved.

And I found back one of the pics of the cap I bought, here it is. It's missing the black/red badge, but I have one laying around already.




I'm 100% sure my jacket never had it, as the eagle patch had been removed, and the holes and threads were very visible, above that there's just maiden-like minty fabric. In contrast to my parka's flap, where the outlines of both patches are still visible.
I could take a pic of the jacket's flap later, when I get the jacket back from the guy who'll affix my eagle patch to it.

And with the plastic you mean stuck on the shoulderboard itself, and not the small loop on the jacket, right?

On a sidenote, were there ever belt used by BGS that had the leather riveted to the buckle with 3 rivets, instead of 3 seams?
The stack where I got my belt from was about 50/50 riveted/sewn.

Cheers,
Michel
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Old 10-17-2015, 04:58 PM   #789
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The plastic is inside "tongue" of the shoulderboard. The riveted belt sound like Feuerwehr or some other civil organisation (maybe even Polizei, but not seen BGS one).

If you do setup with rucksack, I have strangely never seen photos, that actually show Zeltbahn or blanket attached, despite all the leather loops for such purpose.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-18-2015, 06:39 AM   #790
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Well I only have this photo with backpacks and tents worn, strapped to it the same way as done with Tornisters in WW2.
But I think it was from some skiing-event for BGS or former BGS.
But as of yet none in the field, only one with just the backpack.



I won't be hanging the backpack on the mannequin though, but hanging it seperately behind it, to show all field gear better, as I crosspost the photos in several places, and I like stuff to be well in view.

Oh and did you see the wool pants on ebay.de? Are those the Wool pants mentioned before, with lots of differences in comparison to the Sumpf and green cotton ones?

Cheers,
Michel
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Old 10-18-2015, 11:09 AM   #791
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interesting photo of the rucksacks with blanket/Zeltbahn roll, first that I have seen. I knew, that it must have been done at some point! Rucksack was rarely seen, because left mostly in the vehicles or in rear, when on exercises.

Yes, there was pair of the wool BGS field trousers with cargo pockets in similar cut as Sumpftarn and green cotton ones on ebay.de recently, if you mean those.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-18-2015, 11:35 AM   #792
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Here's the pants I meant, is this the correct type wool 60's pants used by BGS?
I sorta impulse-bought it




Cheers,
Michel
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Old 10-18-2015, 01:57 PM   #793
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yes, that is the one

Too bad, that I sold several winter Schiffchen in size 59 couple years ago, that I had...



Regards
Klaus
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Old 10-18-2015, 11:19 PM   #794
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Yup, those are BGS trousers. Shame they were chewed up by moths!

Both the wool and the cotton types were produced through the late 1960s. I have a third type produced 12/75 that is made from similar cloth as the later issued (standardized) trousers, however still in the Sumpftarn style.

Steve
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Old 10-20-2015, 07:15 AM   #795
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Since the BGS conversation turned towards the packs, I just thought I would let everyone know that "The Sportsman's Guide" currently has these in stock for $50.00 http://www.sportsmansguide.com/produ...sack?a=1809720

I have one of these packs that came from a friend in Germany several years ago, but if I was in the market for one today, I would definitely pick up one from the SMG.
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