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MG34 gunner's pouch. 1936 dated.
Old 10-28-2019, 12:37 PM   #1
pzo
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Default MG34 gunner's pouch. 1936 dated.

I consider it very early example of MG34 equipment. It has added some holder for gauge and piece of wood on the bottom. Please watch rivets. They are made of copper! I wonder if those 2 additions are original, from the point the pouch has been made or added later? They rather look like later addition, but when? Maker is well known Otto Koberstein from Landsberg.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 1.jpg (231.3 KB, 169 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 2.jpg (233.7 KB, 170 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 3.jpg (221.5 KB, 170 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 4.jpg (229.4 KB, 171 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 5.jpg (241.4 KB, 170 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 6.jpg (237.5 KB, 169 views)
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Old 10-28-2019, 01:24 PM   #2
me6_130
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This gunner pouch is correct for early MG34s, as the bolt clip is centered. The wooden block can be found in both variations for late MG13 and early MG34 till about 1938. This is because early pouches would have a square oiler model, just as those for MG15. I would think the caliper gauge case brackets would be later added, as it is not standard in all gunner pouches, and your pouch has also had the metal pocket modified to accept MG42 AA sight. I can't see copper rivets but aluminium for the two brackets. The rest are too dirty for me to guess what they are made of.

See the difference between an late MG13 pouch, an early MG34 pouch and a later MG34/42 pouch:

Carles
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSCN6748c.jpg (116.9 KB, 170 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN3822b.JPG (178.7 KB, 168 views)
File Type: jpg 59bb_1b.jpg (52.2 KB, 168 views)
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Last edited by me6_130; 10-28-2019 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 10-28-2019, 02:39 PM   #3
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Hi PZ / Carles,

Nice item PZ , a rare survivor considering it has most all of its component parts fully attached. Careful with that top flap separation. Nicely marked as well. As I recall the same manufacturer for the Zufuhertasche.

As always Carles, good set of comparison pictures showing the differences.

I have one query however, I thought the leather pocket on the inside top of the pouch was for a calibre cylinder? So why the spring jaws in the lid for a calibre cylinder...........or am I being a dunce and missing a trick.

Regards

Tim
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Old 10-28-2019, 02:58 PM   #4
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Ok..........I mixed the pictures up.........dunce it is

Age methinks creepeth up on me!

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Tim
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Old 10-28-2019, 03:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by me6_130 View Post
This gunner pouch is correct for early MG34s, as the bolt clip is centered. The wooden block can be found in both variations for late MG13 and early MG34 till about 1938. This is because early pouches would have a square oiler model, just as those for MG15. I would think the caliper gauge case brackets would be later added, as it is not standard in all gunner pouches, and your pouch has also had the metal pocket modified to accept MG42 AA sight. I can't see copper rivets but aluminium for the two brackets. The rest are too dirty for me to guess what they are made of.

See the difference between an late MG13 pouch, an early MG34 pouch and a later MG34/42 pouch:

Carles
Thank You Carles for Your expertise and very good picture of MG13 pouch! I attach pictures of square oiler. Is it the one that You mentioned? Metal pocket in my pouch has not been modified to accomodate MG42 AA sight. It is slightly bent and depressed so it may look like it was. There is no way to put there MG42 AA sight. I have cleaned rivets so now it can be clearly seen what they are made of.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 1.jpg (234.7 KB, 151 views)
File Type: jpg MG34 pouch 1936 2.jpg (221.9 KB, 151 views)
File Type: jpg oiler 1.jpg (229.6 KB, 150 views)
File Type: jpg oiler 2.jpg (239.4 KB, 151 views)
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Old 10-29-2019, 01:53 PM   #6
me6_130
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Hello J.

Here is a pic of the standard early oiler for late MG13 and early MG34 gunner pouch. It is the model seen in MG15 kits. It is previous to the round oiler. When this later was introduced, the wooden block was no longer inserted in MG34 gunner pouches and production of MG13 was stopped. As I mentioned before, that would have taken place between 1938-39.

See this link:

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=493134



If the rivets on your pouch are not aluminium...I'm not sure the are original, as early pouches have aluminium ones. Perhaps some maker had some older stock of rivets or perhaps the pouch was refurbished in some moment, I don't know. Brass and copper rivets can be found on some Weimar era items.

Tim,

The small leather pocket can only be found in MG13 version pouch, and is for the MG13 little piece that goes in the trigger group. I don't know if the right name is trigger shear...See pics.

Carles
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSC07926b.JPG (243.1 KB, 131 views)
File Type: jpg mg15 infantry version 2 - Copyb.jpg (158.6 KB, 131 views)
File Type: jpg s-l1600 (76).jpg (23.0 KB, 131 views)
File Type: jpg s-l1600.jpg (33.1 KB, 129 views)
File Type: jpg s-l1600 (1).jpg (33.8 KB, 127 views)
File Type: jpg $T2eC16RHJIQE9qUHsiqsBRg!noqD)g~~60_3.JPG (62.9 KB, 127 views)
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Last edited by me6_130; 10-29-2019 at 02:17 PM.
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Old 10-29-2019, 04:45 PM   #7
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Carles, Many thanks for another lesson and great pictures. There were some makers who still used copper and brass in 1936. I have no doubts that copper rivets in my pouch are original. Maybe those makers with name Otto used copper and brass?! Please pay attention to early Lafette part it is not welded but soldered with brass Is Your oiler also made of copper?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Otto Sindel Berlin 1936 frog 1.jpg (243.2 KB, 113 views)
File Type: jpg Otto Sindel Berlin 1936 frog 2.jpg (237.4 KB, 112 views)
File Type: jpg turn tables.jpg (242.4 KB, 113 views)
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Old 10-30-2019, 12:32 PM   #8
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Hello J.

Yes, the oiler is also brass.
I now recall I had (and sold) a Karabinertragevorrichtung (rifle carrier) produced in 1935 with brass/copper rivets and stud. And NO, maker was not called Otto but Koch & Benning See some pics.

Carles
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File Type: jpg DSCN5453b.JPG (107.1 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN5444b.JPG (76.1 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN5446b.JPG (84.2 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg DSCN5449.JPG (84.7 KB, 97 views)
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Old 10-30-2019, 12:45 PM   #9
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Carles,
Do not be so sure about them not being Otto. Impressed on leather are just their surenames. I bet that both of them used name Otto! Not many early things survived so copper/brass parts of equipment are rather unknown among collectors and consequently dubious.
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Old 11-01-2019, 05:53 AM   #10
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Hello J.

I don't know if it is the same Koch...but this one IS called Otto.

https://www.herold.at/gelbe-seiten/s...wZ3/koch-otto/


Carles
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Old 11-01-2019, 06:51 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by me6_130 View Post
Hello J.

I don't know if it is the same Koch...but this one IS called Otto.

https://www.herold.at/gelbe-seiten/s...wZ3/koch-otto/


Carles
I was joking! Otto Koberstein, Otto Sindel and now Otto Koch It must be pure coincidence Anyway a bit strange.
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Old 11-04-2019, 10:23 AM   #12
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No problem with those rivets pzo. Totally original IMO.
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