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SA Marine visor cap
Old 11-10-2019, 05:45 PM   #1
irezuma
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Default SA Marine visor cap

Hello,
I don't find this maker in the base and the cap seems to be like new, what do you think about it ?
Thanks


sorry for the poor photos quality ....
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Old 11-10-2019, 05:46 PM   #2
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2
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Old 11-11-2019, 05:35 PM   #3
stonemint
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Maker would have been Pekuro.
Haupt would have been the retailer.
I have to check and see if #16 matches Haupt.
Looks like a legit wartime marine visor, the question is when was the insignia added.
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Old 11-11-2019, 07:44 PM   #4
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I have a SA Kepi from Anton Haupt.

See post #105 - 109 in this thread: http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=279087&page=3
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Old 11-11-2019, 08:03 PM   #5
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Here is another view of the Kepi tag--looks to be a "16"
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Old 11-12-2019, 03:36 AM   #6
wilhelm Saris
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Where did you find 16 was Peküro?
In the lists from the RZM this number is one of those that is not filled in and so
16 got no number after the publishing of the RZM handbook from 1935. If they
indeed had that number, then it was withdrawn before the publishing of the
handbook.
Peter Küpper got a number, but that was A1/1073. They held this number anyway
since 1938 as it was then included with the RZM mnufacturers list.

Last edited by wilhelm Saris; 11-12-2019 at 03:46 AM.
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Old 11-12-2019, 10:56 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wilhelm Saris View Post
Where did you find 16 was Peküro?
In the lists from the RZM this number is one of those that is not filled in and so
16 got no number after the publishing of the RZM handbook from 1935. If they
indeed had that number, then it was withdrawn before the publishing of the
handbook.
Peter Küpper got a number, but that was A1/1073. They held this number anyway
since 1938 as it was then included with the RZM mnufacturers list.

No one stated 16 was Pekuro. The question is whether 16 matched up with Haupt.
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Old 11-12-2019, 11:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stonemint View Post
No one stated 16 was Pekuro. The question is whether 16 matched up with Haupt.
sorry, I did misunderstood. I thought this was said.
The inside tag is quite early 1933-1935. Haupt might not have been a manufacturer after all, but a seller.
I do not see this name amongst the 1,400 others I have, having an RZM permission.

Last edited by wilhelm Saris; 11-12-2019 at 01:03 PM.
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Old 11-12-2019, 01:19 PM   #9
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Anton Haupt was a retail shop.
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Old 11-12-2019, 02:41 PM   #10
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Here’s another civilian hat with box from Anton Haupt
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Old 11-12-2019, 08:29 PM   #11
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After the introduction of the A1 and A2 licences in March 1935 Peter Peter Küpper was issued 1073 as Wim points out.
Prior to that there was another numbering system although I have never found the listing. Hat manufacturers definitely had Ausweis numbers in 1934 as the numbers can be found in the lists of cap manufacturers who lost their permissions (as published in the Mitteilungsblatter).
The kepi posted would certainly point to Peter Küpper making hats for the distributor Haupt. If only the RZM tag in that kepi was clearer as to the number 16.
Finally, is it just me but the dates of the tag and the cap don't seem to quite match up.
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Old 11-12-2019, 11:24 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derek View Post
After the introduction of the A1 and A2 licences in March 1935 Peter Peter Küpper was issued 1073 as Wim points out.
Prior to that there was another numbering system although I have never found the listing. Hat manufacturers definitely had Ausweis numbers in 1934 as the numbers can be found in the lists of cap manufacturers who lost their permissions (as published in the Mitteilungsblatter).
The kepi posted would certainly point to Peter Küpper making hats for the distributor Haupt. If only the RZM tag in that kepi was clearer as to the number 16.
Finally, is it just me but the dates of the tag and the cap don't seem to quite match up.

Derek, thanks.....
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Old 11-13-2019, 02:52 AM   #13
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The thing that puzzles me is that none of the RZM 1073 marked visor caps I've seen so far exhibit the well known characteristics associated to Peter Küpper e.g. the typical stirndruckfrei sweatband or lining with numerous pleats.
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Old 11-13-2019, 04:53 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derek View Post
After the introduction of the A1 and A2 licences in March 1935 Peter Peter Küpper was issued 1073 as Wim points out.
Prior to that there was another numbering system although I have never found the listing. Hat manufacturers definitely had Ausweis numbers in 1934 as the numbers can be found in the lists of cap manufacturers who lost their permissions (as published in the Mitteilungsblatter).
The kepi posted would certainly point to Peter Küpper making hats for the distributor Haupt. If only the RZM tag in that kepi was clearer as to the number 16.
Finally, is it just me but the dates of the tag and the cap don't seem to quite match up.
I checked all my material from the RZM. Me neither have a list with numbers dated earlier then spring 1934.
So number 16 (either a Nachweis or permission for MH, which is a manufacturer for headgear - Hersteller für Dienstmützen)
was not mentioned when the first numbers were withdrawn in the RZM periodical in May 1934.
For example Friedrich Schmolow from Schlawe at Pommern was withdrawn his permission with the date February 5, 1934.
The number soon was given to Paul Märker from Bremerhaven, anyway before the publishing of the RZM-handbook.

Last edited by wilhelm Saris; 11-13-2019 at 04:58 AM.
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Old 11-14-2019, 12:39 AM   #15
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Thank you for all your research !

So finally a wartime navy cap but probably transformed?

I can ask for more pictures, could some particulars views help?
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