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WWI Non Combatant Pair
Old 09-02-2017, 12:11 PM   #1
bytown
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Default WWI Non Combatant Pair

Purchased from MAS newest update.

Not a collector of Imperial Awards but buy Non Combatant awards when I see them.

My question to those that know.

Is the order of mounting correct or should it be the other way around.

Thanks

Wayne
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Old 09-02-2017, 08:40 PM   #2
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Looks good to me. A 2 place frack bar.
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Old 09-02-2017, 09:55 PM   #3
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Frack Bar eh.

Didn't think of that.

Thanks,

Wayne
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Old 09-03-2017, 12:48 AM   #4
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It's correct for a Frackbar, do you have a picture of the reverse?
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Bayern, Silberne Militär-Verdienst-Medaille König Max Josef I.
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Old 09-03-2017, 03:54 AM   #5
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Looks fine to me as well!
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Old 09-03-2017, 08:16 AM   #6
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Reverse.

Wayne
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Old 09-07-2017, 09:09 PM   #7
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For several reasons, it doesn't look like a frack bar at all.

Before even seeing the reverse of the bar, it's clear that the ribbons are overlapping in the wrong direction for a frack bar. Also, the ribbons are NOT mounted at an angle as they should be for a frack bar.

The view of the reverse, however, shows the needle clasp on the wrong end for a frack bar. It should be on the other end (i.e. the whole clasp setup should be flipped around for a frack bar.)

On top of that, the convex ends of the bar's metal bracket are not trimmed at a slight angle as they should be for a frack bar.

I believe it is just an ordinary parade bar. Perhaps the person assembling the bar didn't know that the EK2 (regardless of being mounted on combatant or non combatant ribbon) is always in first position on a Prussian bar in accordance with Prussian regulations.

Definitely not a frack bar, however.

Last edited by triad08; 09-07-2017 at 09:24 PM.
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Old 09-08-2017, 10:16 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triad08 View Post
For several reasons, it doesn't look like a frack bar at all.

Before even seeing the reverse of the bar, it's clear that the ribbons are overlapping in the wrong direction for a frack bar. Also, the ribbons are NOT mounted at an angle as they should be for a frack bar.

The view of the reverse, however, shows the needle clasp on the wrong end for a frack bar. It should be on the other end (i.e. the whole clasp setup should be flipped around for a frack bar.)

On top of that, the convex ends of the bar's metal bracket are not trimmed at a slight angle as they should be for a frack bar.

I believe it is just an ordinary parade bar. Perhaps the person assembling the bar didn't know that the EK2 (regardless of being mounted on combatant or non combatant ribbon) is always in first position on a Prussian bar in accordance with Prussian regulations.

Definitely not a frack bar, however.
I agree with all of these assertions and I also have the opinion that it is not a frack bar. The owner chose put the war-time help medal in front of his non-combatant EK2. The evidence that triad08 presented is all correct.

The question is why. Bytown realized this when he asked the question "should it be the other way around?" I believe the bar is correct and this is a period construction. The recipient of the medals chose this ordering.

So the question is why the recipient would put the medals in this order. He (or she?!!!) did. At this point, we can only speculate.

My guess is that the owner wanted to "down play" his EK2 award in favor of his wartime help service. Perhaps a doctor, that was more proud of his non-combatant service award (Kriegshilfe Kreuz), rather than his non-combatant version of a combatant award (EK2).
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Old 09-08-2017, 02:17 PM   #9
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The things that got my attention are, the medals look "pulled" to the left a little. Like they've been hanging at an angle left. Also, the war aid cross ribbon has more wear on the left, like the medal rubbed on it for some time.
I do agree that it looks like a regular mount though.
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Old 09-08-2017, 03:40 PM   #10
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Thanks everyone for your comments.

They are appreciated.

Wayne
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Old 09-09-2017, 01:47 PM   #11
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-good one
-good decorations
-frack bar
-easier version without a trapezoid plate
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Old 09-10-2017, 12:58 AM   #12
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If this is a crack bar, then surely the needle set up is the wrong way round?
Makes more sense that the mounted out them together the wrong way round.
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Old 09-11-2017, 06:57 PM   #13
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This book came with the pair.

The person's last name is Fischer.

Can anyone decipher the first name?

Thanks,

Wayne
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Old 09-11-2017, 07:27 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by römischIX View Post
-good one
-good decorations
-frack bar
-easier version without a trapezoid plate
Definitely not a frack bar. The ribbons are not overlapping correctly and mounted at a slight angle the way they should be on a frack bar.

The needle set-up is wrong for a frack bar. It should be reversed.

Since when is a frack bar installed on a trapezoid plate? Typically, the plates are the general shape of a parallelogram.

Somebody please post a picture of a frack bar so romisch can see what a frack bar is supposed to look like.

Last edited by triad08; 09-11-2017 at 07:43 PM.
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Old 09-11-2017, 07:45 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triad08 View Post
Definitely not a frack bar. The ribbons are not overlapping and mounted at a slight angle the way they should be on a frack bar.

The needle set-up is wrong for a frack bar. It should be reversed.

Since when is a frack bar installed on a trapezoid plate? Never heard that one before.

Somebody please post a picture of a frack bar so romisch can see what a frack bar is supposed to look like.
That's my understanding of a typical frack bar: Medals angled - ribbon furls reversed (right over left) and the pin reversed so not as likely to slide off the coat.

Here's typical construction: http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...&postcount=124


I have one 3 placer that has mounted reversed medals, but does not have reversed pin setup or reverse ribbons - not sure why:
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Last edited by Sevrin; 09-11-2017 at 09:05 PM. Reason: Add Photo Examples
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