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Imperial Geman State Mützen Kokardes
Old 10-18-2013, 06:23 PM   #1
Alan
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Default Imperial Geman State Mützen Kokardes

Hi Guys,

As my collection continues to grow with all things Imperial I would like to verify that I have got these kokardes right.

I think this is how it goes.....

1st Row

Anhalt maybe Sachsen-Altenburg
Baden
Bayern

2nd Row

Hessen
Oldenburg
Mecklenburg-Schwerin

3rd Row

Schaumburg Lippe
Sachsen
Reuß and Waldeck

and lastly a Deutsches Reich kokarde
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File Type: jpg Kokardes.JPG (158.8 KB, 162 views)
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Old 01-02-2017, 09:51 PM   #2
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I think top row left is Thuringian
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:46 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccj View Post
I think top row left is Thuringian
Thuringen didn't exist as a State of Deutsches Reich in that time.

But may this can help to verify the colours (from German Wikipedia)
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File Type: jpg Tafel_XVII_Kokarden.jpg (72.2 KB, 104 views)
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Old 01-03-2017, 11:19 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tompress View Post
Thuringen didn't exist as a State of Deutsches Reich in that time.

But may this can help to verify the colours (from German Wikipedia)
Mr Weitze seems to be in agreement with Chip.

https://www.weitze.net/militaria/10/...5__249910.html

Not sure why I cannot upload the pic - keep getting invalid file when I do.
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Old 01-03-2017, 04:50 PM   #5
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Nice helmet, but if I good see, it has 'general' Kokarde of Deutsches Reich, the second on is of Saxon Duchies. Thuringen was not a separate state under this name.

greetings
Tomasz

Last edited by tompress; 01-03-2017 at 05:00 PM.
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Old 01-03-2017, 05:19 PM   #6
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PS. The Land Thüringen was created in 1919 from 8 old German States: Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach, Sachsen-Gotha, Sachsen-Meiningen, Sachsen-Altenburg, Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt, Schwarzburg-Sondershausen & both Reuss Elder and Younger Line.
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Old 01-03-2017, 05:47 PM   #7
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Thüringen was not a state entity in Imperial Germany that is correct but it was a region in Imperial Germany like f.e. Ostfriesland as can be seen in the designation of regiments such as 1. thuerinische or ostfriesische. That just leaves us with the question did these regiments from Thueringen have their own type of kokarde or did these just have the Saxon Herzog one? As the Thueringer one seems to be the same as the Sax. Herzog ones it seems most logically to conclude there was no Thueringer kokarde just the Sax Herz one which would then be the one shown in the top left corner.
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Last edited by kaiserwilhelm2; 01-03-2017 at 06:00 PM.
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Old 01-03-2017, 06:17 PM   #8
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Right, in historical region of Thüringen were used at least four Kokardes: "our" green-white-green of Sächsische Herzogtümer = Saxon Duchies (means Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach, Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, Sachsen-Meiningen, Sachsen-Altenburg), blue-white-blue of Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt, white-blue-white of Schwarzburg-Sondershausen and gold-red-black of Reuss.

greetings
Tomasz
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Old 01-03-2017, 07:53 PM   #9
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kaiserwilhelm2 is correct about Thuringia duchies, Sächsische Herzogtümer. I should have said duchy I suppose. The Kokarde in question appears to be green/white/green (green/silver/green) used by Herzogtüm Sachen-Altenburg and/or Herzogtum Sachen-Coburg und Gotha, and Sachen-Meiningen, Thuringian Duchies.

Glad to see participation on this. it only took us a little over 3 years....
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Old 01-03-2017, 07:57 PM   #10
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Credit to the fellow who created



Should have clarified that it's the duchies not the grand duchy or principalities

The Thuringian states refers to the following German federal states within the German Reich:

The Grand Duchy of Saxe-Weimar-Eisenach
The duchies of Saxe-Altenburg, Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, and Saxe-Meiningen
The principalities of Reuss Elder Line, Reuss Younger Line, Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt and Schwarzburg-Sondershausen
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Last edited by ccj; 01-03-2017 at 08:23 PM.
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Old 01-04-2017, 03:32 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccj View Post
Glad to see participation on this. it only took us a little over 3 years....
HAHAHA I had not noticed that this tread was actually started in 2013!
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Old 01-04-2017, 03:37 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tompress View Post
Right, in historical region of Thüringen were used at least four Kokardes: "our" green-white-green of Sächsische Herzogtümer = Saxon Duchies (means Sachsen-Weimar-Eisenach, Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, Sachsen-Meiningen, Sachsen-Altenburg), blue-white-blue of Schwarzburg-Rudolstadt, white-blue-white of Schwarzburg-Sondershausen and gold-red-black of Reuss.

greetings
Tomasz
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Old 08-19-2017, 12:21 AM   #13
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Some great information here thanks guys.

The chart by Christian Gollmar is a great addition for reference.

I have managed to find a few more Kokardes since my original post and with the new information would this be correct?

1st Row

Deutsches Reich
Deutsches Reich
Baden
Bayern
Braunschweig
Preußen

2nd Row

Mecklenburg
Oldenburg
Hessen
Reuß
Schaumburg Lippe
Saschen

3rd Row

Sachsen Herzogtümer
Sachsen-Meiningen
Waldeck
Württemberg
Bremen
Hamburg

4th Row
?
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File Type: gif Imperial German Kokardes.gif (88.8 KB, 43 views)
File Type: jpg P1040003.JPG (148.8 KB, 44 views)
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