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Bundesrepublik Deutschland, 1949-Present From West Germany through to the modern reunified German Republic.

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Old 03-23-2015, 10:50 PM   #31
Tom B
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Thanks for this thread ! It's very helpful ! Tom
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Old 03-24-2015, 08:01 AM   #32
Gordon Craig
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Steve,

Another variant I didn't know about! Your killing me!!!!!!!!!!but keep up the good work.

Regards,

Gordon
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Old 03-24-2015, 11:53 AM   #33
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Steve,
very impressive research (and collection)! The rarer trousers can be especially hard to find. It is surprising to me, that there exist so many variants of pattern.

I would be interested to see the palm variant fabric, if you can post photo of it.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:18 PM   #34
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Yes, it seems there are quite a few variations out there I think that I've identified them all by this point. Anything that is unidentified is likely to be a "one off" and not something that was trialed or issued.

In October 2005 a large piece of the cloth came up for sale on eBay. Unfortunately I did not bid hard enough and lost. Fortunately, I kept all the information The 11m2 piece sold for EUR 108,90, which is a lot for a piece of obscure cloth. The black print roller was used for the experimental snow camo in 1960, but as far as I know nothing was made from the full color cloth.

As you can see it is standard Splittertarn printing without the black rain strokes. Instead, a black palmleaf roller was used. This cloth is more evidence that the Bundeswehr was under pressure to not have a pattern that was so easily traced back to the Third Reich, but resisted by trying to have a compromise pattern that had "tradition" but not as strong of a look to the original pattern.

Steve








Last edited by Collectinsteve; 03-24-2015 at 01:26 PM.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:25 PM   #35
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Quick follow up. If you look closely it appears that the red/brown color "bled" outside of its intended area. It could be that this cloth was part of a rejected batch or part of a batch of standard cloth, then was experimented with. Or it could be that the cloth was deliberately printed for this test and the production was a little sloppy. Either way, I do not think the BW would have spent money to convert this quality cloth into a uniform.

Steve
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Old 03-24-2015, 10:27 PM   #36
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thanks for the photos. Is certainly very interesting.

Regards
Klaus
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Old 09-04-2018, 02:53 AM   #37
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Hello. I've shown this pictures already in another Bw Splittertarn thread but perhaps you'll like them also.

Bw Gebirgsjäger Splittertarn pants. Pictures are from a very early 1958 GJ album of my collection.

Regards, Matthias
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Old 09-05-2018, 04:48 PM   #38
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Fantastic pictures, Matthias! The special GJ trousers are very rarely seen in pictures and the jackets are clearly standard infantry type. Which is interesting to me because I'm still looking for pictures of GJ of LL wearing the special jacket that was intended for one or both of them. So far I've only seen a single picture.

Thanks for posting!

Steve
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Old 09-05-2018, 08:15 PM   #39
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Here's some trivia about the Splittertarn hoods.

There are at least four distinct types:

Type 1 = 5 female snaps along the neckline, 0 snap at the top edge
Type 2 = 5 female snaps along the neckline, 1 female at the top edge
Type 3 = 4 female and 1 male snaps along the neckline, 1 female at the top edge
Type 4 = 5 female snaps along the neckline, 1 male above the middle neck female, 1 female at the top edge

The hoods come in all five varieties of Splittertarn:

1. Blue (Soft)
2. Blue
3. Green
4. Broad
5. Broad Inverse

Hoods come in at least two sizes:

One size seems to be very common with a smaller one less common. I have 9 hoods in my hands at the moment with 8 being the common type, 1 is the small type. The small one in my collection is Blue and Type 2. There could be other sizes.

Thoughts on what all this means:

From what I can tell the original hood design is Type 1, as this is in the Blue (Soft) material and that is the earliest dated production uniform I know of. It is also the configuration on the earlier Leibermuster hood. Type 1 is by far the most common. Type 2 seems to have come out towards the end of production with Type 3 being the last one for regular production. The only Type 4 that I've seen is for the experimental FJ Broad Splinter uniform produced after regular production had ceased. It should be noted that Type 3 is also found on my Broad Inverse jacket, which was produced between the end of regular production and the experimental FJ set.

My speculation is that the original (Type 1) configuration was found to be troublesome when the hood was worn on the shoulders. Too floppy! The first change (Type 2) allowed the top of the hood to be snapped directly to the jacket neck by first unsnapping the snap at the middle of the neckline. This was found to be sub optimal, so they changed the jacket to have 4 snaps and the hood's middle snap on the neckline was reversed so it could snap to the top edge of the hood (Type 3). Perhaps the move to four snaps was found inadequate to keep the hood tight to the jacket, so they went back to 5 snaps on the collar/neckline and a separate pair of snaps dedicated to securing the hood to itself (Type 4).

It should be noted that at the same time the very similar Belgian jackets had 5 snaps on the collar/neckline and 2 dedicated sets for snapping the hood together. The very similar Spanish airborne type, which came out at end of Splittertarn production, is the same as BW Splittertarn Type 1.

Probably more than anybody would ever want to know about hoods, but there it is

Steve

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Old 09-06-2018, 03:54 PM   #40
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Great stuff in this thread.

That cloth is unique and I have never seen it before.
Thanks for posting.

The pics are also rare images !!


Thanks all round.

owen
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Old 09-06-2018, 09:12 PM   #41
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Thanks Owen. There's so much left to know about the obscure corners of the Bundeswehr.

The Splinter Palm pattern was never made into uniforms as far as I know. Well, at least nothing beyond samples seems unlikely. It was apparently printed around 1960.

The same Splinter Palm pattern was printed on wool. Apparently the same wool that was used for Filzlaus. I've seen a sample of the cloth which came from the Bundeswehr.

The only item I know which was made from the pattern was the rare experimental reversible Schneetarn set. And only the two black screens were used.

My speculation was the Splitter Palm pattern was an attempt to distance the uniform from the original WH pattern a bit more, yet still retain some historical tie to it. I believe Broad Splinter was a similar attempt that the BW felt wasn't different enough.

Steve
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Old 12-05-2019, 01:49 PM   #42
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Great stuff.
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Old 12-09-2019, 02:17 AM   #43
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Back in the late 1990's I purchased a splittertarn GJ knee length pants at a fleamarket in Germany. They were in excellent condition and the price was out of this world (10 Deutschmarks). There was only three people selling stuff at the fleamarket since the weather was very bad (blizzard conditions). I also purchased an early BGS zeltbahn and 1959 dated sumpftarn trousers from the same seller. It all cost me 50 Deutschmarks. I sold the GJ a few years later thinking I needed money to finance another purchase. Who knows where they are now. I still have the BGS items. Some of the best purchases I made at German fleamarkets. Had to find deals like that now.
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Old 12-09-2019, 10:08 AM   #44
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From what I remember early 1990s it was 2:1 DM:USD, so you got the trousers for $5. Oh boy did you score with that one I'd put the value somewhere around $250 on ebay.de these days. Hard to know, though, since I've not seen one come up for sale for a very long time.

The BGS Sumpf Zelts have crazy up and down pricing these days. 10 years ago you could get them for EUR 35 pretty easily, now it's about double that and sometimes higher. There's plenty out there for sale so I'm kinda surprised the price spiked up that much. I don't think you should worry about price declines for that one any time soon!

Steve
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Old 12-09-2019, 03:20 PM   #45
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BGS items seem to retain their value pretty good. I got lucky last fall and found the one BGS item I have been looking for, for many years, an original wood BGS wall locker for uniforms and equipment. It has the space for FAL Rifle also. I thought I would never find one.
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