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Whitetop Luft Generals Visor for review
Old 05-17-2018, 02:59 PM   #1
Randalls
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Default Whitetop Luft Generals Visor for review

Looking for opinions on this visor, the only shots I could get. Not the typical but it looks good to me but will let others decide. Any and all opinions welcome. Thank you as always.
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File Type: jpg luft gen whitetop 2.jpg (223.0 KB, 666 views)
File Type: jpg luft gen whitetop 3.jpg (145.4 KB, 658 views)
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Old 05-17-2018, 08:15 PM   #2
stonemint
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Randall--
The maker is Paul Preuss of Stettin.
(They were also a distributor for other makers).

I cannot rule it in/out based on these photos alone.
See if you can get under the hood photos, as well as closeups of the piping joinders.
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:17 AM   #3
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Additional shots..
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:18 AM   #4
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and more...
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:19 AM   #5
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interior...
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Old 06-15-2018, 07:38 AM   #6
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Interesting piping 'connection' in photo four. I saw a similar connection in my white Teno posted here (http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...39245#poststop)
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Old 06-15-2018, 08:09 AM   #7
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Rick, that is interesting. Here are two more close up shots for comparison.
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Old 06-15-2018, 09:39 AM   #8
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I think it's a fake, the cut in the liner is suspicious, with the double phobrbics (I do not know how to say it in English).IMO
It is the second visor(for general) that I see in the forum

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Old 06-15-2018, 10:47 AM   #9
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Yes, I agree with Carlo--it is a Frankenstein.
Note pinking-sheared lining and crudely overwrapped piping.
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Old 06-15-2018, 11:05 AM   #10
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I have no doubt that this one originated in the Kansas City area back in the late 80s/early 90s.


It was probably dumped thru Manions or Der Gauleiter--if someone has back issues, it is probably in one of those catalogs.
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Old 06-15-2018, 03:17 PM   #11
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Pretty sure that's a Bundeswehr white cover and a pretty odd one at that.
Notice which way the weaves are going! very unusual.
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Old 06-16-2018, 05:58 AM   #12
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Obviously, Paul Preuss, Militaereffekten, Friedrichstrasse 8, from the 1938 Stettin adressbuch:

http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/w/index....djvu&page=334
http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/w/index....djvu&page=534
http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/w/index....djvu&page=749
http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/w/index....djvu&page=748

Just out of curiosity and not out of theme, the page of the stettiner uniformmakers:

http://wiki-de.genealogy.net/w/index....djvu&page=765

Now I move on to specific observations:

- First time I see the Preuss logo surname written with ß. The TR period’s visors of this manufacturer/retailer are very rare and the only two examples I have seen in my life bore the surname as Preuss and non Preuß. One might therefore think that the lining is original but it comes from an older Preuss’ visor (maybe adapted, cutting it out a little ... why & when … I can not say because I'm not a sibyl or an oracle), also because of its overall graphic style . We must not forget that this company was in fact founded in 1872. No possibility, in my opinion, of a reuse of some post-war materials because Szczecin was incorporated into Poland.

- Ben's assessment is very much grounded in my humble opinion and therefore:

Randalls my friend: first of all, it is therefore highly advisable that you make a comparison between the TR and the BRD white covers. There is a lot of material on WAF about them ... then the discussion can continue. This is at first glance a very captivating visor, but it requires a lot of caution and a solid pedigree, because, always in my humble opinion, it has some very serious problems .

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Old 06-16-2018, 07:33 AM   #13
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Gents, thanks for your comments. Just a few points and questions having in hand.

Where did the myth of pinking shears come from? I don't believe that all the hat maker in the TR didn't use pinking shears? Seems like an impossible thing...

I agree it is an uncommon visor but it doesn't compare to BW post war caps, I have handled enough to know the difference.

The piping is almost identical to Rick's Teno...

There is absolutely no evidence of the hat being reworked, remade other then the way the sweatband is machine sewn and hand sewn.

The bird is sewn on and not removable, perhaps a replaced post war is my assessment.

It is a rare maker and have seen this exact label in other period visors deemed original.

I realize a cap like this is going to be controversial and I am not discounting what has been said but the jury is still out. It is from a very reputable source so no problems there either.
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Old 06-16-2018, 09:09 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Randalls View Post
Gents, thanks for your comments. Just a few points and questions having in hand.

Where did the myth of pinking shears come from? I don't believe that all the hat maker in the TR didn't use pinking shears? Seems like an impossible thing...

I agree it is an uncommon visor but it doesn't compare to BW post war caps, I have handled enough to know the difference.

The piping is almost identical to Rick's Teno...

There is absolutely no evidence of the hat being reworked, remade other then the way the sweatband is machine sewn and hand sewn.

The bird is sewn on and not removable, perhaps a replaced post war is my assessment.

It is a rare maker and have seen this exact label in other period visors deemed original.

I realize a cap like this is going to be controversial and I am not discounting what has been said but the jury is still out. It is from a very reputable source so no problems there either.
Just do a search there is a very good thread , actually a few, on"pinking" shears.
Piping is not the problem, the "joints" are imo.
Check the allignment of the liner in the hat, also the sticthing and pleating of the liner is problematic.
You might also want the eagle to be checked out as well.
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Old 06-17-2018, 06:44 AM   #15
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Pinking shears ~ While I know that it’s been accepted/conventional wisdom that pinking shears weren’t used in the manufacture of headgear there are, I’ve noted, those who don’t completely ‘buy’ the fact that pinking shear usage is a hands down evidence of a Frankenstein. (http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...pinking+shears) “many collectors swear that pinking shear edges are an immediate death knell on any TR cap. I'm not positive about that, as I seem to remember seeing that on original caps in the distant past.” SgtB Obviously, an interesting thread to review is http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...shears+uniform wherein Chris relates: “pinking-sheared linings are a major RED-FLAG--however, it does not automatically mean the hat is a fake--but it does mean that the hat requires veryclose scrutiny….” That said, take note of how many folks piped in saying they looked at their caps/linings and found no evidence of their use… Where the patents (Curtis Weidauer’s patent ~ US ~ 1,970,406 in ’35) & German Patents (also ’35) for pinking shears in the same time frame as rise of the Third Reich appearing to officiate the introduction of the ‘tool’ to the clothing racket and, I seem to recall a recent thread showing photos of uniform construction nuances having signs of the use of these shears that leads me to speculate that they were certainly around yet had not seen significant commonplace usage. As such, like my ‘old friend’ Nick said in the thread above: “I’m not ruling it out…”

Let’s see some analysis of the other issues as an educational excersise since this puppy listed for more than a bag of premium pakalolo out of Kona or an eighteen pack.

Rather than the kiss of death I think a closer look & detailed analysis of other nuances (with example imagery if making a point) is in order because (with respect) saying the subject piece looks like a Bundeshehr/Bundesmarine lid without matching imagery is, I believe, unfair to Randalls.
Over at WarRelics & GMIC:

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