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Schuma M43
Old 01-10-2017, 06:53 AM   #1
Max Wünsche
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Default Schuma M43

I would appreciate some opinions on this M43 with Schuma insignia.

It looks to be marked with a 43 to the inside crown and with green buttons.

Many thanks in advance.

Apologies for the lack of larger detailed images.







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Old 01-10-2017, 07:24 AM   #2
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Insignia is good but also easy to find. The cap is a hard one. With Schuma everything is possible but that makes it very hard to judge. Honestly I don't get a warm feeling from the cap itself. But perhaps it's a foreign item. I have no clue.

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Old 01-10-2017, 12:49 PM   #3
ton g
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To me it looks like marked 53, wich could be the size...
Can't comment on the originality...

Grss
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:51 PM   #4
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If that cap in such outstanding condition should turn out to be the real deal I´d be positively surprised.

I am not an expert in that field but Schuma stuff seems to be much rarer than anything SS.
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Old 01-10-2017, 02:52 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ton g View Post
To me it looks like marked 53, wich could be the size...
Can't comment on the originality...

Grss
You are correct, its a size 53.

My eyes are clearly not working past 10pm...
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Old 01-10-2017, 03:43 PM   #6
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Green buttons are typically post war repainted . The cap looks to be old , 50's at least but a hand inspection would be useful regarding the badge applying !
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Old 01-12-2017, 01:23 AM   #7
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Any other opinions would be very much appreciated.

Many thanks to the opinions given thus far, it is much appreciated.
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cap
Old 01-12-2017, 04:10 AM   #8
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Default cap

I seem to remember this cap being posted here or on GDC many years ago? As it is would not want it unless someone gave it to me as with features such as the green painted buttons it falls into the wishfull thinking category.
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Old 02-05-2017, 06:10 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paul.j View Post
I seem to remember this cap being posted here or on GDC many years ago? As it is would not want it unless someone gave it to me as with features such as the green painted buttons it falls into the wishfull thinking category.
I was contacted by another collector who showed me his virtually identical black Schuma M43, also with green buttons.

As I know have it in hand, I definitely think it is the real deal.

This was listed incorrectly on the dealers site as a DAF cap! And very cheap!
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Old 02-05-2017, 09:04 AM   #10
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The liner is encouraging, and I like the rough wool appearance and minimal stamps. However, I agree these are very easy to make up from 1950's civil type caps. As a community, we don't have a good handle on what are "issue" SCHUMA uniform item looks like. The converted SS black tunics and other reissued pieces aside, it's a leap of faith on most of these.

I don't like the green buttons - seems improbable to me that wartime buttons would be painted this shade of green. I got a DAK cap with a non-standard Jaeger cap badge on it in the same shade of paint, though.

Interesting cap - regards, Robert
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Old 02-06-2017, 12:03 AM   #11
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Quote:
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The liner is encouraging, and I like the rough wool appearance and minimal stamps. However, I agree these are very easy to make up from 1950's civil type caps. As a community, we don't have a good handle on what are "issue" SCHUMA uniform item looks like. The converted SS black tunics and other reissued pieces aside, it's a leap of faith on most of these.

I don't like the green buttons - seems improbable to me that wartime buttons would be painted this shade of green. I got a DAK cap with a non-standard Jaeger cap badge on it in the same shade of paint, though.

Interesting cap - regards, Robert
Many thanks for your comments Robert... Regarding the leap of faith, I completely agree!

With regards to the green buttons, I too was sceptical until I saw an identical cap in another collection which has made me think there is more to this cap. Unless someone is out there mocking up green buttoned Schuma M43's....

Of course I cannot be 100% certain as I have no 'period photographic proof' showing green buttons in use, but then it could easily be said that there was such a diverse mix of uniform items being used by the Schuma that this could very well be the real deal.

The dealer whom I purchased it from did not know it was Schuma insignia on this cap as he had it listed as a DAF cap. The fact that it was so cheap was just another of the reasons why I took the - leap of faith...!
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Old 02-06-2017, 05:50 AM   #12
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Hi Max,

Interesting there is another identical cap around; for me this would be a positive. Majority of the collectors don't fancy or know about Schuma and in my believe when these caps would be post war and rebadged, good chance it would have been turned in a "very late last ditch Panzer cap", preferably W-SS of course.

All wise things have already been put forward I think.
The buttonholes are less period convincing but I have seen original caps with the same kind of blanket rough lining. The cap should be very small being a size 53; is this correct?

Would be nice if the other owner allows photos to be published? In case I'll encounter a third example, I'll know what to do ;-).
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Old 02-06-2017, 07:11 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zauberflöte View Post
Hi Max,
Interesting there is another identical cap around; for me this would be a positive. Majority of the collectors don't fancy or know about Schuma and in my believe when these caps would be post war and rebadged, good chance it would have been turned in a "very late last ditch Panzer cap", preferably W-SS of course.

All wise things have already been put forward I think.
The buttonholes are less period convincing but I have seen original caps with the same kind of blanket rough lining. The cap should be very small being a size 53; is this correct?

Would be nice if the other owner allows photos to be published? In case I'll encounter a third example, I'll know what to do ;-).

Hi Zauberflöte,

That is also the conclusion I came to... If you were going to fake a black M43, it would 99.9% of the time be trying to pass it off as a Panzer cap, not Schuma, and definitely not as cheap as I purchased it for.

If the other collector had not contacted me with images of his own cap I would still be 50/50 on this cap... The Green buttons were always a question mark for me, hence why I brought it up in my initial post on this thread, although seeing this other identical cap has made me think that it is not so improbable.

It is definitely a size 53 also...

As far as posting the other collectors cap for comparison, I asked his permission although I have to respect his decision to not want it posted on the forum.

Please understand that I have no reason to lie / mislead about having the images of this other cap as I have no intention of selling mine for financial gain.

.
.
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Old 02-07-2017, 04:23 AM   #14
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....as soon as the word is out these caps are or might be original; the Schuma insignia will soon be replaced by a SS skull no doubt....

Enjoy the cap, I would comfortably hang on to it...
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