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Shoulder Board I'd Help
Old 10-16-2011, 11:54 PM   #1
motojosh
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Default Shoulder Board I'd Help

Wanted to see if I could get some help identifying the shoulder board on the right. It's reminiscent of an offizier-stellvertreter rank board, but I've never seen a shoulder board this large or with the additional lace in the center. Prussian military official board on the left shown for scale. Measures about 5.5" x 2.5". Thanks for any help, -Josh



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Old 10-17-2011, 06:11 PM   #2
Chip M
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I once had a board that was larger than yours with an even larger Wappen on it. I turned out it was from the 1880s and a police official. The main problem is that these older pieces are not in any currently available reference material. There do exist books that detail the uniforms of civil officials from the earlier periods, but I have not seen one in years. Wish I could help.

Chip
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A few more for id
Old 10-19-2011, 01:48 AM   #3
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Default A few more for id

Thanks Chip. Here's a few more I acquired last weekend that I would like to get some opinions on. All of the officer boards have green Saxon flecking. Would green flecking even be correct for the 116th infantry regiment w/ the missing crown? Thanks again, Josh


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Old 10-19-2011, 08:22 PM   #4
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Josh,

That M15 officer's board is not for the Hessian 116th, but rather the Saxon Ulan Rgt.Nr.21. The red underlay denotes Ulans and yellow was the regimental color. They did wear the same cypher and crown as the 116th. The Kaiser had several stylized monograms/cyphers that were worn by more than one unit. At least three units wore another one of his cyphers and other than the color, they are exactly the same (IR.145, Ldwr.IR.2 and Jäger zu Pferde Rgt.1).

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Old 10-19-2011, 08:32 PM   #5
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Thank you Chip, much appreciated. Are there any reference books you could recommend for a new collector of shoulder boards? Do you have any information on the boards with the crown and the one with the single pip?

-Josh
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Old 10-19-2011, 08:44 PM   #6
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Josh,

The board on the far right is an Unterbeamte piece for an official of the Lazarettverwaltung, that is, an inspector of the hospital administration.

The Oberstleutnant appears to be a Saxon Jäger officer.

The pair with the crowns can be one of two things. If the color darts are actually green, the only Saxon unit that I know of that would have worn just a crown would have been an officer of the Kadettenkorps. If the darts are actually blue, then they would be from the Bavarian Infantry Leib Regiment.

Chip

Last edited by Chip M; 10-19-2011 at 08:56 PM.
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Old 10-19-2011, 08:56 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motojosh View Post
Are there any reference books you could recommend for a new collector of shoulder boards? Do you have any information on the boards with the crown and the one with the single pip?
Josh,

That kind of depends on what model shoulder strap you are talking about. Kraus's "Die feldgraue Uniformierung des deutschen Heeres 1907-1918" has color plates that show the M07 and M15 shoulder straps. Though very good, it is incomplete. Kube's "Militaria der deutschen Kaiserzeit Helme und Uniformen 1871-1914" has color plates showing all the branches royal cyphers for the prewar blue uniform. You don't really have to read German to use these.

Kraus is rather pricey, so if you want to get by cheaply, I would use the on-line resources, like the Kaiser's Bunker or the Databank of the Feldgrau Forum.

I have some black and white plates in digital form that could be e-mailed, if you are interested in seeing what the cyphers are.

There currently is no book in English on the subject. I have been collecting material for years to fill that gap, but it won't be ready any time soon. There is talk in France right now of publishing a reference on the subject, but once again, it may be only available in a foreign language and that too could be several years off.

Regards,
Chip
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Old 06-02-2018, 12:45 PM   #8
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As an update regarding English language reference material on German shoulder insignia, there is a relatively new book available. "Under Arms for the Kaiser" by Mike Kelso, has wonderful photos and explanations of imperial era shoulder insignia. It's laid out by unit type (infantry, cavalry units, pioneers, etc.) and seems to focus more on high end officer's pieces. There is plenty of other information, to be sure, but some things, that would help those that are beginners or want to research a piece quickly, (like rosters of wartime units) are missing. All and all, a very good book and the only English language book currently available on the subject.
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