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Order of Battle and Individual Research Forum Order of battle, unit history, personality research.

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Old 11-16-2019, 04:55 AM   #76
Lionel H.
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Thanks Guys. Here is a Pic O have just discovered. Captioned (IMO) "Vor dem Abrücken zur Übung 16.Fj.L." (16.Fahnenjunker-Lehrgang = O.A.L.). If somebody recognize this Barrack... The eagle on the front could be an help....
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Old 11-29-2019, 05:33 PM   #77
Archi
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Hello !

First, I wanted to thank all of the contributors for their help, who made this nice collection possible !

Below is now a compilation of all data in this thread :
The courses are sorted by date. Behind them, I listed the posts within this thread, where the info is coming from.
For most of the courses we have now two or more confirmations (and also finally one for course Nr. 8 ! ).

Only one example had been shown for courses #5 and #8 and surprisingly, still not a single one for course # 12 !
For course #12 we have the info given by Absolon (scan below), but it would be interesting to see a real world example.

Finally all examples from 16. - 18. OA courses would be still interesting to see, as by that time, the dates of the courses
were very different.

So far for today. There are more interesting questions, but that needs more time.

Best regards,

Archi

=========================================
Updated overview on O.A./Fhjk.Lehrgänge :

1939 :
_1. OA.-Lehrgang : 23.08.39 - 17.10.39 [post #2, #6, ]

_2. OA.-Lehrgang : 25.10.39 - 26.01.40 [#25 (3x),#27, #43, #45, #64]


1940 :
_3. OA.-Lehrgang : 05.02.40 - 03.05.40 [#25, #41,]
[AHM 1939, p.383, Nr. 856]

_4. OA.-Lehrgang : 21.05.40 - 08.08.40 [#15,#26, #31]

_5. OA.-Lehrgang : 19.08.40 - 19.12.40 [#16, ]


1941 :
_6. OA.-Lehrgang : 15.01.41 - 30.04.41 [#5, #15, #23, #34, #38 (2x), #46, #53, #59]
[AHM 1940, p.522, Nr. 1201]

_7. OA.-Lehrgang : 14.05.41 - 20.08.41 [#23,(#39), ]

_8. OA.-Lehrgang : 14.09.41 - 15.02.42 [#72]


1942 :
_9. OA.-Lehrgang : 24.02.42 - 30.05.42 [#27, #41]
[AHM 1941, p.562, Nr. 1048]

10. OA.-Lehrgang : 20.06.42 - 26.09.42 [#17, #34, ]

11. OA.-Lehrgang : 12.10.42 - 16.12.42 [#23, #47]


1943 :
12. OA.-Lehrgang : ~ 02.02.43 - 02.04.43 [ ... ? ]
[Absolon, Bd. VI, S. 921, scan below ]

13. OA.-Lehrgang : 15.04.43 - 23.07.43 [#34, #57]

14. OA.-Lehrgang : 06.08.43 - 23.11.43 [#4, #27, #41, #48]


1944 :
15. Fhjk.-Lehrgang : 08.12.43 - 15.03.44 [#23, #40, #58]
[Absolon, Bd. VI, S. 743, S.779]

===========================================

16. Fhjk.-Lehrgang :
- 18.06.44 (?) - ??.??.44
- 28.03.44 - 04.07.44 [#26, #58]


17. Fhjk.-Lehrgang :
- 04.10.44 - 13.02.45 [#18, ] ????
- 10.10.44 - 22-01.45 [#27, #49]
- 23.08.44 - 19.12.44 [#49]
~ 01.12.44 - 01.02.45 [#60] (unclear whether 17. or 18. course)


18. Fhjk.-Lehrgang : ???
- 11.11.44 - 07.03.45 [#62, ]
~ 01.12.44 - 01.02.45 [#60] (unclear whether 17. or 18. course)
- 13.11.44 - 01.03.45 [#5, ]
- 10.02.45 - 10.05.45 [#19, ]
- 20.02.45 - end not noted [#23, ]
- 20.02.45 - 04.04.45 [#41, ]
- 03.02.45 - 29.05.45 (probably not finished) [#42]
- 00.12.44 - end unclear (probably not finished) [#44]

....
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Old 12-04-2019, 03:39 PM   #78
Lionel H.
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Dear Archi. This summerizing is very much appreciated, thank you for your invaluable efforts to give us the opprortunity to increase our knowledge on this difficult matter. I have a question for you : for the 16, 17 and 18 Fahnenjunker-Lehrgaenge, the different dates you are mentioning are those revealled by the documents shown before. Is then- according to you - just one of the date listed correct ? -- or -- , all dates are correct and just variable among the different arms (Pionier, Art., Inf. Pz...) and schools ??
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:36 PM   #79
Lionel H.
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Archi this is a small present for you, I know you like "Milowitz". Did you knew that young officers who earned there officer graduation named them "Milowitzern" ??

The Letter there after was send from Lt. Wolfgang Jaenecke to Lt Hans Köhler. Moving is that Hans never red this letter, he was KIA durint the Normandy Retreat on 20.08.1944 in Saint-Lambert... The letter was re(adressed to his parents in Ludwigshafen... Not easy to read, I transfer it in modern german as good as I can... These young officers were sent on all hot places of the front, and they were often the first to fall...

"Lieber Hans, Breslau 30.9.44. Lange habe ich nichts von dir gehört, und ich hoffe, bei dir geht alles klar ! Deinen Willen..... du ja jetzt wohl haben ! Hoffentlich seid ihr nicht auf einer von den "Sauhaufen" in Frankreich geworfen ! Ja, ich habe hier gut .... daheimn aber was bleibt mir übrig ! Mit meiner Hand ist es das alte Lied. Es .... jetzt bei mir, ob ich weiter studierenkann oder ausbilden soll ! Operiert werde ich wahrscheinlich nicht mehr, aber Gedult muss ich haben ! Von den Milowitzern (!) Lt Gerhard Pietsch ist gefallen ! Kalle liegt in Limbeck/Sachsen im Lazarett von den Beinen bis zum Kopf im Gips. Hüftschuss bei einer Übung !! im Lemberg damals noch !! Benker ist zur Zeit auf ambulant daheim. Beinstreifschuss bei Kauen im August. Ali liegt mit Brustschuss in Pilsen, den er bei Kolo??? bekam, ihm geht es aber besser. Irmfried habe ich in Oberschreiberhau besucht. Lungensteckschuss, jetzt nicht mehr so schlimm. Kirsten ist Adjutant in Italien, Hoffmann Kp.Chef in Norwegen. Mehr weiss ich auch nicht ! Alles Gute weiter, schreib mal ! Wolfgang".

They were together by Schule VII f. OA.d.Inf. Milowitz bei Prag, 3.Insp., 12.Abt. (13.O.A.L.)
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Old 12-08-2019, 12:38 PM   #80
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Hello !

Excellent. Many thanks to Lionel for sharing those letters.
It gives some very impressive insights, what happened to a group of members of such an O.A. course.

It seems to me that the 3 months of hard training really made them comrades for lifetime (so they felt
as a group of "Milowitzer").
And many stayed in close contact with each other and were also interested what happened
to other participants.

It allows allows an rough overview, what happened to them within ~ a year after finishing the O.A. course,
end of July 1943 :
Lt. Wolfgang J. : Hand wounding ?!
Lt. Hans K. : KIA (Normandy or after)
Lt. Gerhard P. : KIA
Lt. Kalle .... : Hospital (heavily wounded)
Lt. Benker : gracing shot at the leg, ambulant treatment at home
Lt. Ali ... : Hospital, shot in the breast (but healing)
Lt. Irmfried ... : Lungensteckschuss (but healing)
Lt. Kirsten : Adjutant in Italy (perhaps doing well ?!)
Lt. Hoffman : Kp.Chef in Norway (perhaps doing well ?!)

2 of them KIA (> 20%), 5 WIA (> 50%), 2 doing well (but even that is unknown).
Obviously, this is small number statistics, but my general understanding is, that this is not too
far from reality.

Thanks and best regards,

Archi
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Old 01-18-2020, 08:32 AM   #81
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I think it is time to bump this tread with another 8 OAL (Holy Grail) entry. I do not claim any ownership and all the credits go to Militaria Relics.

It seems that the clerk did a mistake and wrote 9 OAL instead of 8 OAL. However, the dates of the course are the same as the one posted by Lionel H (post #72) (16.09.1941 - 15.02.1942) and it is confirmed in the Page 21 with the entry 8 OAL 9 Inspektion.

Maybe it will be helpful for further research.

Again, all the credits go to Militaria Relics.

Best regards,

Josep
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