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Loewe Berlin, Steyr, or Danzig?
Old 04-22-2007, 02:10 AM   #1
MauserKar98k
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Default Loewe Berlin, Steyr, or Danzig?

Hello guys,
While checking out the newest stuff at my local antique gun shop, I spotted 3 nice looking Gewehr 88s for $225 each, all made before 1898. They were all in equally good condition. None of them have macthing numbers. One was made by Loewe Berlin, one by Steyr, and one was made in Danzig. My question is, if I was to only get one of them, which of the 3 manufacturers would be the most desirable?

MauserKar98k

Last edited by MauserKar98k; 04-22-2007 at 05:08 AM. Reason: Matching numbers info
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Old 04-22-2007, 04:47 AM   #2
rudolf
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Hello

I would take the gun that is number matched.

About the manufacturers: Danzig was as state factory (common), Loewe and Steyr were private factory's. Of all private factory's, Loewe made the most M88.
So, Steyr looks to me the most desirable.

But: this is only my opinion.

greetz
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Old 04-22-2007, 08:52 AM   #3
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Since you said that none of them were matched, I think that I would look for the one that was the most matched. If it is just a matter of all of them being bolt mm only then I would look to see if any were non-modified to the 88/05 standard and check the condition of the finish and it's orginality to the rifle. In other words all any or all three of these Turkish re-works?

Depending on the answers to the above points, I agree that the Styer may be the "neatest" and perhaps rarest (I'll check my references) but I can say for sure that the Danzig is the least encountered by me of the above three makes on these rifles.

I generally find that about 90% of the G88 that I have seen are dated between 1890 and 1893 (inclusive), therefore dates earlier or later than these are rarer, but perhaps not more valuable.

You should also check the unit markings on the band or bands.

Basically the condition and degree of originality is the main factor here not the makers
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Old 04-22-2007, 12:07 PM   #4
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Loewe was a Jewish owned company, that is why the G88 was called the "Jew rifle".
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Old 04-22-2007, 09:25 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Beckett View Post
Loewe was a Jewish owned company, that is why the G88 was called the "Jew rifle".

Buckeye ; again your ? shows !. Loewe was not the first manufacturer nor the 'designer' of the 88. There is a bigger story to the "jew" disparaging comment associated with the 88. I suggest you take some allowance money and buy some books with it and learn something in place of being so post happy.
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Old 04-22-2007, 10:12 PM   #6
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when did he say they were the first manufacturer or designer of the 88? in another post?
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Old 04-22-2007, 10:43 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gew98 View Post
Buckeye ; again your ? shows !. Loewe was not the first manufacturer nor the 'designer' of the 88. There is a bigger story to the "jew" disparaging comment associated with the 88. I suggest you take some allowance money and buy some books with it and learn something in place of being so post happy.
I agree with the above comments.

Josh may not have stated that Loewe was the designer or original maker, but he implied it by his simplistic connection between the maker and his suggestion of the nickname. As recommended in the above post, there is a lot to this story and Josh's post was mis-leading....at best.

From the standpoint of pure workmanship, the G88 (and k88 and G91) were the finest smokless powder long arms ever built for the German military, at least in my opinion.
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Old 04-22-2007, 10:57 PM   #8
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Aw jeez, Josh and gew98 are at it again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by phild View Post
Since you said that none of them were matched, I think that I would look for the one that was the most matched. If it is just a matter of all of them being bolt mm only then I would look to see if any were non-modified to the 88/05 standard and check the condition of the finish and it's orginality to the rifle. In other words all any or all three of these Turkish re-works?

Depending on the answers to the above points, I agree that the Styer may be the "neatest" and perhaps rarest (I'll check my references) but I can say for sure that the Danzig is the least encountered by me of the above three makes on these rifles.

I generally find that about 90% of the G88 that I have seen are dated between 1890 and 1893 (inclusive), therefore dates earlier or later than these are rarer, but perhaps not more valuable.

You should also check the unit markings on the band or bands.

Basically the condition and degree of originality is the main factor here not the makers
The main reason that I asked about the makers was that they are all so close in reguards of condition, I figured I'd ask what maker was the rarest. All of the Gew 88s in question were modified to take stripper clips (they have the strips welded just behind of the bolt handle), so yes, they are all Turkish re-works. I believe all were made between 1891 and 1893. I also think I saw some unit marks on an upper band on at least one of them.

I figured you all would say the Danzig one would be the most desireable. Personally, I was leaning towards getting that one, but I have to get my hands on the money first.
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Old 04-23-2007, 06:14 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gew98 View Post
Buckeye ; again your ? shows !. Loewe was not the first manufacturer nor the 'designer' of the 88. There is a bigger story to the "jew" disparaging comment associated with the 88. I suggest you take some allowance money and buy some books with it and learn something in place of being so post happy.
I never said that it was the first manufacturor or the designer of the G88, by the way, I hate the Buckeyes .
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Old 04-24-2007, 01:43 AM   #10
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May be true

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache...lnk&cd=3&gl=us

Also Sauer was owned by a Jewish family until it was taken over.
Karl Gustoff an renamed firm of Jewish origin, I am not sure who was the previous owner before it was renamed for a NS leader or something.
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Old 04-24-2007, 02:53 PM   #11
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Did Sauer produce the G88?
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Old 04-24-2007, 09:37 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MauserKar98k View Post


The main reason that I asked about the makers was that they are all so close in reguards of condition, I figured I'd ask what maker was the rarest. All of the Gew 88s in question were modified to take stripper clips (they have the strips welded just behind of the bolt handle), so yes, they are all Turkish re-works. I believe all were made between 1891 and 1893. I also think I saw some unit marks on an upper band on at least one of them.

I figured you all would say the Danzig one would be the most desireable. Personally, I was leaning towards getting that one, but I have to get my hands on the money first.
There is no "rare" manufacturer of the gew88. If scarcity is to be found it is in late manufactured gew88's. That is post 1896 dated specimens of any maker - Amberg producing the last examples as late as 1898/99.
Just because a gew88 has the 88/05 charger guide mod does not make it turk - where did you get that erroneous data ?. The germans modified many thousands of gew88's to the mauser charger , and the vast majority of these they gave to turkey as wartime aid and sold post war to same were the 88/05 charger adapted 88's.
The thing with gew88's is that there are oodles of turked with and south american boat anchors about, and as such the only examples that retain any semblence of collecting value are those examples in matching unaltered german issue trim .While these are not rare , often condition is a major detractor ( missing bolt head , bubbafied stock , and rust of course ).
To Mike W. ; What is your post about exactly ? .Sauer was not taken over by the nazis. Simson was grabbed by the nazi party and put under party ownership as "Gustlof" ( 337 & bcd coded weapons production ).
JP Sauer & Sohns produced 98k's up until 1944 when the russians knocked on their door.

Last edited by gew98; 04-24-2007 at 09:40 PM. Reason: spelling murder mayhem haste.
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Old 04-24-2007, 10:47 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gew98 View Post
There is no "rare" manufacturer of the gew88....Just because a gew88 has the 88/05 charger guide mod does not make it turk - where did you get that erroneous data ?. The germans modified many thousands of gew88's to the mauser charger , and the vast majority of these they gave to turkey as wartime aid and sold post war to same were the 88/05 charger adapted 88's.
I may have used the wrong wording here. By "rare", I was simply wondering if one maufacturer was more desireable than another. I suppose there are really not many rare Gewehr 88s because over 1,000,000 of them were produced.

I know that the Germans modified these to use the Mauser charger after they realized that his clip system was better than Mannlicher's, but at least one of the Gewehrs in question had crossed out unit marks and the Turk cresent moon on the bolt handle. At least one other one had intact unit markings.

Last edited by MauserKar98k; 04-24-2007 at 11:02 PM.
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Old 04-25-2007, 07:26 PM   #14
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It's not that they "realised" the mauser charger sytem was better , but more that they tried to streamline their ammo and ammo packing variety being they had so many gew88's still in service.
That the VAST majority of gew88's modified to the mauser charger were sent as aid to turkey , austria and bulgaria more likely tells how hte germans actually regarded the charger modified 88's.
As well it was easier for the germans to supply their forces with the mannlicher clip loaded 8mm as there was a fiar amount on hand , another reason why they farmed out the mauser charger modified 88's to allies.
Lined out and multiple unit marked 88's really add nothing to value unless they are matching. When these rifles were surplused to South America and Turkey the regimentals were not struck out ( this was only done while in german service - and then not always ).
Again let me emphasize , that unless a gew88 is matching or has some spectacular feature like being an 88/14 value is on the very low side. collectors only want matching decent examples , not boat anchors nor post german issue muddled with mismatched peices. Got to gunboards.com or Parallax Bill's if you want to know what beaters/shooters are currently worth.
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