How many PAB's were awarded?

[jurggie]

I've been doing some research on the numbers of badges and medals that have been awarded, and in a number of cases it remains unclear, or the answer I found isn't trustworthy in my opinion.

For example the PAB. According to wikipedia (it's the only source I can find), approximately 35.000 badges have been awarded, of which 22.000 were silver en 12.500 bronze.

That seems completely unrealistic. If you compare it with the Deutsches Kreuz for example of which 28.500 were awarded and is a lot rarer and more expensive.

Are there any other sources that give a better indication?
Personally I think there's no way it could have been less than 150.000 and probably well over 200.000.

[Don D.]

Those old and low numbers have been around for years with no proof or citation. I too think it was a lot higher. How many tankers were in a 1939/40 panzer division? Approx 3000 tanks into France alone with each having a 4-5 man crew. While not every one of them would have earned it on that campaign I would think a high percentage would. Then all the other campaigns......

Too bad no one ever kept track of issuing combat awards.

[peterm]

Originally Posted by Don D.

Approx 3000 tanks into France alone with each having a 4-5 man crew.

That's a little bit too much:

For attacking France in 1940 we had:
955 Panzer II (3 men)
228 Panzer 38t (4 men)
349 Panzer III (5 men)
278 Panzer IV (5 men)

(from: von Senger und Etterlin / "Die deutschen Panzer 1926 - 1945")

But You are both right: the Wikipedia-numbers for issued PAB's must be total nonsense.

Kind regards,

Peter

[Panzercracker]

From a technical standpoint, Peter's figures say that there were 6912 men fielded to man 1810 tanks. Wikipedia may be close with their estimate at 35000 because the guys who fought in France 1940, would go on to fight in other theatres/campaigns. --Rgds, Ken

[Bcarver]

I am also wandering if Wiki may be actually close. Looking at hundreds of panzermen portraits very few are wearing the pab even in 1945. Now I know we have to take into account the deaths ect but I am thinking the awarded numbers can't be super high.

[jurggie]

Originally Posted by Bcarver

I am also wandering if Wiki may be actually close. Looking at hundreds of panzermen portraits very few are wearing the pab even in 1945. Now I know we have to take into account the deaths ect but I am thinking the awarded numbers can't be super high.

A portrait was not made everytime a soldier or a relative earned a medal. I have dozens of Sterbebilder with medals that are not (or partially) shown on the portrait photo.

You have to take in account that soldiers were often months or even years from home. During that time they could have earned (so to speak) five medals.

Assuming that approximately 17.000.000 men served in the Wehrmacht between 1939 en 1945, there must have been (according to my figures) awarded between 200.000 and 300.000 PAB's.

Also the number of EK I's tends to be a lot higher than the figures that usually circulate on the net. The number of VWA's on the other hand is generally overestimated.

[Don D.]

Originally Posted by Bcarver

I am also wandering if Wiki may be actually close. Looking at hundreds of panzermen portraits very few are wearing the pab even in 1945. Now I know we have to take into account the deaths ect but I am thinking the awarded numbers can't be super high.

I imagine that alot of those portraits were taken upon completion of training and right before shipping off to the front. We do the same thing at our training schools as well. A heroic picture for loved ones to have yet no time to have earned an award. Even in the field, wearing a PAB was problematioc. How many do you have to lose, or uniforms you tear, catching it on something as you get in and out of the tank before you decide not to wear it in the field?

[Don D.]

Originally Posted by peterm

That's a little bit too much:

For attacking France in 1940 we had:
955 Panzer II (3 men)
228 Panzer 38t (4 men)
349 Panzer III (5 men)
278 Panzer IV (5 men)

(from: von Senger und Etterlin / "Die deutschen Panzer 1926 - 1945")

But You are both right: the Wikipedia-numbers for issued PAB's must be total nonsense.

Kind regards,

Peter

This is just a snapshot of one point in time and does not take into account replacements for wounded men and the exapansion of the panzerwaffe prior to Barbarossa. And don't forget the side campaigns of the Balkens and North Africa.

[peterm]

Originally Posted by Don D.

This is just a snapshot of one point in time and does not take into account replacements for wounded men and the exapansion of the panzerwaffe prior to Barbarossa. And don't forget the side campaigns of the Balkens and North Africa.

Hi Don !

You are right, but my posting was only the answer to Your posting No. 2 with numbers of france-campaign in May 1940.

Kind regards,

Peter

[jurggie]

Originally Posted by Don D.

This is just a snapshot of one point in time and does not take into account replacements for wounded men and the exapansion of the panzerwaffe prior to Barbarossa. And don't forget the side campaigns of the Balkens and North Africa.

Also don't forget that the PAB wasn't exclusively awarded to tank crew. Also Panzergrenadiere, Panzerjäger, PAK-crew, etc. could get a Panzerkampfabzeichen.