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-   -   Patience is a virtue (http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1005108)

Dansson 05-26-2019 06:24 AM

Patience is a virtue
 
2 Attachment(s)
Some of you were expecting probably some high end order or rarity here.

Well this is for sure a hard to come by Military Passport to a World War 1 fighter.
I choose the name of this thread due to how I acquired it. As some of you know I collect documents and Military passports and research them, I was scrolling through MP's and as usual they're full of text that is perhaps not raising any interest in most of us. However I've learned to read through them page to page, as sometimes there's something hidden there as in this case. It can be frustrating at times.

You see the stamps of I.R.2. and the cursive text referring he was in the Bavarian 2.Infanterie Regiment amongst other things.
You go to the bottom of the page where the most interesting points are usually written. You notice he was wounded by a bullet to the right shoulder 17.7.1916 in Fromelles, 12.10.1916 wounded by a shrapnel ball in the left leg at the Somme.
Next page says "le Barqué" is the more precise place on the Somme where the wound was sustained and that the Shrapnel ball hit his knee. Below states that he's been awarded the Prussian Iron Cross 2.Class (P.E.K.2). it is quite clearly written there. Check the battles he participated in on the glued paperclip on the left.

Ok, I return back to the other page to read the top part.
Now I notice that he wasn't transferred to the 2.I.R. before May 1917, that he served in Bavarian Resere Infanterie Regiment 16 before his transfer.


Well such a small writing in cursive Sütterlin could have gone unnoticed :)
If you don't yet know why Bavarian R.I.R.16 is desired midst paperwork collectors you should Google the unit at once :D

otter76 05-26-2019 08:28 AM

Most interesting Dan. You made me google as fast as a dog can eat his rice bowl :laugh:
Smart , mate :smokin:

ROBB 05-26-2019 08:32 AM

I am not going to google but guess at Hitlers unit. Great find. Rob

TheMadBaron 05-26-2019 09:39 AM

Maybe one of the guys who traded jam rations for Hitler’s cigarettes. Great find!

Dansson 05-26-2019 09:53 AM

They were both wounded at the Somme in the leg, just a week's difference (Hitler 5th October, this man 12th October). A thought that passed my mind more than once; They most likely were in the same hospital and same department due to the type of wound and unit. Perhaps they chatted, traded jam for smokes as suggested or perhaps he was one of them who Hitler described as demoralisers in Mein Kampf? Who knows.

This passport is mysterious in a way. Its got a certain charm as we will never know, just feed the thoughts of a possible event.

bolewts58 05-26-2019 11:13 AM

Very interesting. I too love Military passes for the the same reason of finding hidden gems of information such as this.

Just a small note: It is not Sütterlinschrift, but Kurrentschrift. Sütterlin was only developed between 1911 and 1915 by Ludwig Sütterlin as a simplified, modernized version of Kurrentschrift. Although it began to be taught in German schools from 1915, it did not come into general usage until the 1920s. It was banned by the Nazis in 1941, but was revived as a secondary cursive script after the war and was taught in German schools well into the 1970s.

Therefore, cursive writing in WWI and early Reichswehr military passes is either in traditional Kurrentschrift, sometimes in Anglicized cursive or a combination of the two.

lugernut 05-26-2019 11:54 AM

I have a German WWI trench knife that has the initials AH on the the grips and it makes you wonder what if?

Dansson 05-26-2019 12:11 PM

It's a shame that German awards are not in general numbered like Soviet awards; which you can fully research if you have contacts to the archive.

Well this paper collecting has a good side and it is that you must discover it yourself. Some consider it bad however :D

gregM 05-26-2019 07:55 PM

Interesting thread and a very interesting piece of history.
Well done Daniel.

ODW 05-27-2019 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bolewts58 (Post 8458601)
but was revived as a secondary cursive script after the war and was taught in German schools well into the 1970s.

wikipedia says so, but practically only people born bevor the war could read it. Sure some schools may have teached it, but it was the exception rather.
Some other sources tell that it was taught around 1954.

Grandma (DOB:1920) could read it, parents (DOB:1949/1958) not.
"Sütterlinkreise" consists of the pre war generation.
https://www.shz.de/lokales/stormarne...t-id29232.html

bolewts58 05-27-2019 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODW (Post 8459122)
wikipedia says so, but practically only people born bevor the war could read it. Sure some schools may have teached it, but it was the exception rather.
Some other sources tell that it was taught around 1954.

Grandma (DOB:1920) could read it, parents (DOB:1949/1958) not.
"Sütterlinkreise" consists of the pre war generation.
https://www.shz.de/lokales/stormarne...t-id29232.html

Well,I can read Kurrentschrift and Sütterlin and I'm not German. Many of the German members here and on other sites can read it perfectly well.

ODW 05-27-2019 09:05 AM

Quote:

Well,I can read Kurrentschrift and Sütterlin and I'm not German. Many of the German members here and on other sites can read it perfectly well.
We were not talking about who can read something because he teached it himself, we were talking about what was when taught in german schools.

I also can read Kurrant because its very similar to the "Schreibschrift" i learned in school.
Sütterlin (german Alphabet) its much harder to read than Sütterlin (latin Alphabet).

Heran 05-28-2019 07:40 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Hi Dansson,

As usual, you show as Quality and Nice pieces. Thank you and congratulations for your collection.

Yes, that RIR 16 has something. From my side, I have a Sterbebild from a Person from that Regiment, who was awarded with the Tapferkeitsmedaille. See also what he did, as shown in the
Bayern Goldenes Ehrenbuch.

Best Regards

Antonio

Dansson 05-28-2019 10:03 AM

Thanks!

Heran: that's an interesting Sterbebild. I don't know what the practice was in post-war Germany with those cards; but his photo is his military time one which is nice.

I have some nice Militärpässe, this one received a good reception so I might post some others in the future when I find the time to write.


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